I am using 8 gig cards rated at 133x kingston and the specs were well above what canon suggested but i am finding my videos jerky(highest res setting) on playback through say elements 7.0,through the camera they are fine .
Should i be converting the *.mov file to something else ,can anone suggest why i have this

It probably not the card, but the computer. The 5D mk II's MOV files are recorded at a very high bandwidth which most PCs cannot handle well. Take a look at the Cineform Showcase forum for "Neo Scene". It converts the MOV files to Cineform HD intermediate files (which give you many benefits!). You can play and edit those CFHD files in real time. It's costs $99 from videoguys.com.

Julian

try using powerdvd 9

Any modern computer should be able to play these files as long as it is capable of 1080p playback of any form e.g. BluRay. This rules out the little netbooks like the MSI Wind as their Intel Atom processor & modest graphics cards struggle with any HD video but. I can confirm that a new model Mac Mini is perfectly capable of playing these files out of the box.

NeoScene may be useful on Windows as an Intermediate CODEC when editing but if you just want to play the videos then you can convert to a lower bit rate or resolution using the excellent & free MPEG Streamclip Squared 5 - MPEG Streamclip video converter for Mac and Windows (http://www.squared5.com/)

Stan said he was playing them back through an NLE (Premier Elements) and the MOV files were stuttering. Having just re-read his post, it also sounds as though he is maybe trying to play the video clips back directly from the card, rather than by downloading them to the computer first.

John, you recommended Power DVD in another thread. Did you resolve the audio issue with Power DVD?

Julian

Stan, it isn't the cards. I use nearly the same ones. If the in camera playback doesnt stutter, it isn't the card.

My nearly brand new editing PC stutters while playing these .movs. I convert all mine to Cineform and they play flawlessly at full frame, even in an NLE with multiple layers. Cineform Neo Scene is a must have if you are on a PC.

Not yet, haven't had time to check, same problem with total media theater 3, plays 5d files full res and smooth but no sound. Not to concerned with sound as I record to a separate pro capture setup. but it's a nice way to review files on a big screen in the comfort of my office.


jh

Needless to say, I agree with Dylan on this. Neo Scene just works great. It had its ups and downs when it was first released (including an incompatibility with Nero 7), but everything is fixed and it works like a champ. It even fixes the crushed blacks issue which most of the other suggestions do not.

Julian

thanks for all the ideas ,will try neo scene next ,i do transfer the movies to the pc and play them from there .
Also the movie maker (winxp or vista)will not look at these files (unknown)
Appreciate the getting back to me

I have Dell with Intel 4 core setup. If I try to play the media from the card or transferred to my hard drives, full screen, there is stutter. If I reduce size while play through latest version of Quicktime, stutter is eliminated. Conclusion ? My system/video card can't convert the full size image quick enough.

When I use NeoScene, and convert, full screen play back is clean.

I'm really surprised at canon for creating an *.mov file which is not friendly with xp or visa
I did convert the video file to an *.avi and that was not too bad but i guess the proper term is stutter,i have a canon S80 that takes videos at 1024x768 and they are flawless,i have not found neo scene yet for playback,i don't like quicktime becasue it takes over all video files
Also does the auto focus work in the movie mode?

Also its not the systems as i have fast hot systems powerful video and my results are such that i started this thread asking about it

Go to Cineform.com and download the free 15-day Neo Scene trial. You won't be sorry you did.

Julian

thanks will do tonight,just did a test ,recorded a video then converted it to mpeg4 using mk convert and it worked perfect in the high res.
But i will download the program memtioned.

a lot of programs will run the video ,ie nero .power dvd ver8.0 and the video flow is fine but no audio ,so to get this video working you have to convert the file to something other than *.mov or use Neo Scene

there is no trial download ,they must have stopped it

It's there. Go to the Neo Scene (http://cineform.com/neoscene/) web page and click on the "Try It" button. Enter your info, and they'll email you a link to download the trial.

Julian

thanks will do tonight, just did a test ,recorded a video then converted it to mpeg4 using mk convert and it worked perfect in the high res.
But i will download the program memtioned.

Stan,

If all you want to do is just play un-edited raw footage, there are plenty of ways to do it, many of them free. The problem is that the Canon 5D mk II MOV files cause problems on most computers -- blown highlights and crushed blacks, and stuttering being the most obvious, and video/audio rates being less obvious. Again, if all you want to do if play the un-edited footage and you don't care about these problems, then use whatever software you want.

If however you do care about fixing these problems, then none of the software mentioned, except for Neo Scene will help you. And none of them will help you to edit the footage in Premier, execpt for Neo Scene. Converting the MOV files to some random format will most likely cause a loss in quality, as opposed to Neo Scene, which will actually improve the quality for editing.

Julian

I'm really surprised at canon for creating an *.mov file which is not friendly with xp or visa
I did convert the video file to an *.avi and that was not too bad but i guess the proper term is stutter,i have a canon S80 that takes videos at 1024x768 and they are flawless,i have not found neo scene yet for playback,i don't like quicktime becasue it takes over all video files
Also does the auto focus work in the movie mode?

Also its not the systems as i have fast hot systems powerful video and my results are such that i started this thread asking about it

Stan you are dealing with full HD 1920 x 1080 here, out put through a complex codec. A NeoScene conversion "fixes" (old photographic reference) the file into an editable and playable full HD file.

the playback was not really the issue ,it was the saving of high quality video and possibly writing to a dvd.
Simple program like movie maker does not accept the *.mov file from the camera,neither does pinnacle12,corel video X2 ,i was just looking for a smooth edit and copy to a prg and writing it to dvd .Like the canon S80 --record use any video software and then write to a dvd (at 1024 x 768) not the 5D is much better video but its not as simple.
I converted it and then ran it through software and it was fine ,but you're saying i 'll loose quality..
I had read that corel video studio would accept the file from the 5d then write to a dvd (wrong)
I have downloaded neo scene and we'll see what happens.
Thanks all

I downloaded neo scene and it is a coverter like AVS convert ,so why go through such a cost just use AVS convert ?
Am i going to loose quality?

Maybe i asked the wrong questions ----what software would allow me to use the video on the flash card ,do a bit of editting add a few titles then write it to a dvd so one could run it on a tv type dvd playback unit?
Would the adobe video software do the trick ,or was there something that came with the canon camera

I downloaded neo scene and it is a coverter like AVS convert ,so why go through such a cost just use AVS convert ?
Am i going to loose quality?

AVS convert does not create the intermediate format that NeoScene makes. It just transcodes from one final format to another. It doesn't fix any of the problem that the Canon native MOV files have (crushed blacks, blown highlights, frame rate errors etc - search the Cineform forum for more details). You'll suffer a generation loss going from the MOV file to the file output by AVS convert, then you'll have another generation loss when you render the file from your editor.

Julian

Maybe i asked the wrong questions ----what software would allow me to use the video on the flash card ,do a bit of editting add a few titles then write it to a dvd so one could run it on a tv type dvd playback unit?
Would the adobe video software do the trick ,or was there something that came with the canon camera

On a PC, you'll have to convert the MOV files to another format to make editing possible. As we keep suggesting, NeoScene is the way to go. Once you have your Cineform intermediate files (which are actually better for editing than the original MOVs), you'd edit them whatever non-linear editor you chose. Common NLEs on PCs are Adobe's Premier Pro and Sony's Vegas. Once you've made all your edits, you'd output the footage to DVD through a DVD authoring program like Adobe Encore.

BTW, in another message you said, "use any video software and then write to a dvd (at 1024 x 768)". The DVD format is standard definition, not HD, and it's format is 720x480, not 1024x768. You can't make a DVD with a 1024x768 movie... it has to be converted to 720x480 at some point in the workflow.

Julian

thanks ,just needed all the facts pounded in,i'll go for the neo scene and learn how to handle it and drop the AVS convert .i appreciate the sticking with the thread assistance.

stan

VLC is a free media player that will play 5D II videos smoothly using the settings shown on this page (http://www.theis.dk/blog/index.php/17/01/2009/5d-mark-ii-video-playback/).

The videos from this camera are not just copy and manipulate.
I have been at this now for 3 days,i have videos with audio and without ,videos that jerk, videos that are smooth but no audio.
The neo scene does do the trick but a 649 meg *.mov file becomes a 1.9 gig file after neo scene converts it to a neo scene *.avi, so a 4.79 gig dvd is not going to hold much video going at this rate.
What are people doing with the high quality video from this camera ,is the apple computer the answer.
This is just like stepping back in time when we used to edit video (composite or s-video and it was difficult) but then along came dv which made it quite simple..
I am not making much head way here

looks like there is trouble with the video ,came across this article...(copied /pasted)
(i am disappointed but when it comes to the video maybe the video camera is the wayto go not having a still/video camera)
Pros:
Amazing Video Quality for the Price (and I do mean amazing, especially in low light with a good lens)
Wide variety of High Quality Interchangeable Lenses

Cons:
Auto Focus is Manual (must push AF-ON button every time you wish to achieve focus lock)
AF is Slow
Extremely Difficult to Hand Hold and Keep Steady (no shoulder mount, or in camera stabilization)
Tripod Basically a Requirement
Internal Mic picks up every little noise including, and especially the AF motors and IS motors
External Mic Basically a Requirement
Difficult to judge focus from the LCD screen when shooting in low light
No manual control of Aperture, Shutter, or ISO
4gb Clip Limit (about 12 Minutes in HD)
Image degrades due to heat over time. Must allow the camera time to "cool off" in between long takes.
No Included Editing Software
Very little software available to the prosumer/consumer for editing footage
Expensive Computer Gear and Editing Set-up Required for most Use (or tanscoding to an intermediate codec)
Recent Computer Gear Required just for Playback of unedited files straight from the camera.

The Hype
Canon owes a huge debt of gratitude to one Vincent LaForet for his early release of a short concept video entitled, Reverie. I believe that video alone probably created more buzz for this product than anything, and I do mean anything, that Canon themselves have done. When I first saw the video, I thought wow, that's a pretty nice music video. But, having heard about a number of the limitations of the video mode like the 4gb file size limit, etc. I thought well, at least it will be something nice for my wife to use to shoot the kids with in low light.

The video mode in the Canon 5D MKII is basically useless for the average consumer/ prosumer. I can think of only one or two instances where this video mode would shine for a prosumer. Both require a fixed focus situation. At a school play, or a concert you will be able to get unbelievable natural light footage, provided you stabilize the camera with a tripod.

The neo scene does do the trick but a 649 meg *.mov file becomes a 1.9 gig file after neo scene converts it to a neo scene *.avi, so a 4.79 gig dvd is not going to hold much video going at this rate.

A 1.9GB Cineform HD AVI file is 1920x1080 resolution. A video DVD is 720x480. Apples and oranges, Stan.

What are people doing with the high quality video from this camera ,is the apple computer the answer.
This is just like stepping back in time when we used to edit video (composite or s-video and it was difficult) but then along came dv which made it quite simple..
I am not making much head way here

I think you need to decide what you want to do with this video! It feels like we're chasing you while you change what you want to do! :-)

If you want to edit video in an NLE on a PC and burn a it to DVD, get NeoScene, use it to convert your MOVs to AVIs, then make your edits in the NLE. Then output it to 720x480 in your DVD authoring program.

If you just want to watch it, play it back direct from the camera to your Hi-Def TV using an HDMI cable.

If you want to store/archive it, buy a tape backup and backup the original MOVs.

Julian

Julian
I just got this camera so i'm learning,had the 20d and have the xl1s.I have worked with video in the past and it seemed to work out ok with the software i was using ,along came this format and i ran into trouble.
But i'm on the right track now ,i used neo scene did the convert to neo scene avi and now you're saying i can edit my results then save the video (whats NLE) using nero or any of the writing software to a dvd ,mind you the files can be large .
I am anxious to make this work as its great to be able to have quality stills and videos from the same camera.
What editing program would you recommend that has a timeline ( i like the drag and drop into a timeline)

If you're a PC user, I recommend Vegas Pro. If you know Windows programs like Word and PowerPoint, you'll find that it's really intuitive to use. They have a free 30-day demo, so you can check it out risk free.

Sony Creative Software - Download: Vegas Pro (http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/download/trials/vegaspro)

Oh, and "NLE" is "non-linear editor". Basically, it just means video editing software.

NLE - Non-Linear Editor. Examples are Adobe Premier Pro, Sony Vegas, Avid, etc.

When it comes to purchasing an NLE, it depends a lot on your budget, your computer specs, and your preferences. I use Premier Pro CS3. I actually bought CS3 Production Premium, so I got Adobe Encore (for authoring DVDs), AfterEffects, Photoshop, and several other apps with it. CS3 is out of production, having been superseded by CS4. Premier pro, like all NLEs, is pretty expensive (go to the Adobe web site for prices).

Without investing in an NLE, I don't know how you'd edit your footage. I don't know what you're using now for your XL1S footage, but if you were able to edit the 1440x1080 footage with that, you'll most likely be able to edit the CFHD 1920x1080 footage too.

I use Adobe Encore to author DVDs. Again, I don't know anything about using Nero to do it. I'd imagine Nero is pretty limited and all you can do with it is feed it a movie file and say "make me a DVD." That's far different from using DVD authoring software.

Again, remember that the CFHD AVI files and your final edited movie are indeed huge, but they will be down-rezzed to 720x480 by the DVD authoring program so that they are within the DVD specifications. This will result in the files being substantially smaller.

Julian

I never would have considered any camera that does not put out a quicktime file format.

I'm really surprised at canon for creating an *.mov file which is not friendly with xp or visa
I did convert the video file to an *.avi and that was not too bad but i guess the proper term is stutter,i have a canon S80 that takes videos at 1024x768 and they are flawless,i have not found neo scene yet for playback,i don't like quicktime becasue it takes over all video files
Also does the auto focus work in the movie mode?

Also its not the systems as i have fast hot systems powerful video and my results are such that i started this thread asking about it

The video mode in the Canon 5D MKII is basically useless for the average consumer/ prosumer. I can think of only one or two instances where this video mode would shine for a prosumer. Both require a fixed focus situation. At a school play, or a concert you will be able to get unbelievable natural light footage, provided you stabilize the camera with a tripod.

Do you mean useless for the average consumer in the was that penicilin is useless to the average consumer, or a Boieng 747 is useless to the average consumer? Because, both of these tools are useless at first, but if you take the 15 minutes to LEARN HOW TO USE THEM, they really become surprisingly useful.

I never would have considered any camera that does not put out a quicktime file format.

You mean as opposed to: XDCAM, DVCPRO HD, Red RAW, etc?

Stan, if all you want to do is take the video & burn it to DVD why are you recording in 1920x1080p HD? You can record in 640x480 SD & those files will surely play easily on any PC.

thanks ,i'm going to keep trying using the neo scene to convert then i'm going to try vegas ,i'll get there ...it will take some experimenting
Mind today i looked at an apple computer with final cut but it can be costly too

Besides looking at the results of a converted *.mov canon 5D file then running the file are there specs that depict the quality ie if the result of the conversion of the *.mov file is avi H264 (avc) 1400kpbs and audio 192kbps mp3 are we talking this is a good file to output(it looked good)
In fact the best i have seen so far

On a Mac you don't need Final Cut to edit this footage. iMovie which ships with every Mac handles Canon 5D Mk II .MOVs just fine. It's far less sophisticated than Final Cut Pro or even Final Cut Express but is far more functional than e.g. Windows Movie Maker. For quick & simple editing it's a neat program.

Besides looking at the results of a converted *.mov canon 5D file then running the file are there specs that depict the quality ie if the result of the conversion of the *.mov file is avi H264 (avc) 1400kpbs and audio 192kbps mp3 are we talking this is a good file to output(it looked good)
In fact the best i have seen so far

Stan,

I'm sorry, I don't really understand the question. Is the CFHD AVI file good enough to output? Output to what? It's a 1920x1080 square pixels, 29.97 fps AVI file. It's good enough to output to HD BlueRay (1920x1080), SD DVD (720x480), MPEG-2 (your choice of resolution), and pretty much any other format. Cineform HD files are used in the film industry to create the final prints for motion picture films, so yes, I'd say they're good enough for output! :-)

Julian

After converting the *.mov file the file playback was good ,picture and audio were good but i was wondering what the file specs are ,were there losses .When you play back a video you have no idea how good it is because the player does not show the file contents ie1920x1080
During conversion the program indicated it was H264(avc) 1000 kbps and audio mp3 192 kbps,i'm asking if these specs are an indication of a good quality video file.


stan
By reading your thread above i'd say my file is good ,i'm happy with the results
i won't be needing a mac

The audio is not MP3, it's 16-bit PCM. And it depends on your player and your screen, as to whether it shows the full 1920x1080 display.

Julian

During conversion the program indicated it was H264(avc) 1000 kbps and audio mp3 192 kbps,i'm asking if these specs are an indication of a good quality video file.1000Kps (1Mbps) is a rather low bit rate for a Full HD video. 1280x720 HD video uploaded to Vimeo gets converted to about 5Mbps while for video uploaded to SmugMug 1280x720 HD is 3.2Mbps with 1920x1080 is about 7Mbps. Here is an example of a short clip converted to 10Mbps using MPEG Streamclip uploaded to SmugMug in various sizes & bit rates Barkers Videos (http://www.barkersvideo.com/gallery/7631400_4c2WD/1/#497160602_Z8vUb-A-LB) I normally set audio to 128Kbps AAC

At the end of the day if you are happy with the quality of the video then that is all that matters.

At the end of the day if you are happy with the quality of the video then that is all that matters.Even more important - if the audience is happy with the quality, then it's all good. :)

the video is very good ,i'm not there yet but getting close ---what size was that file (audio video is perfect)

the video is very good ,i'm not there yet but getting close ---what size was that file (audio video is perfect)The original file from the camera was about 250MB. The sizes of the different versions at that link are roughly:-

1920x1080 146MB
1280x720 66MB
960x540 38MB
640x360 27MB
320x180 13MB

Barkers Videos (http://www.barkersvideo.com/gallery/7631400_4c2WD#493388225_SQ6VP-A-LB)

As soon as I got NeoScene working, I threw together some clips from a recent trip to Los Angeles Chinatown (it was Chinese New Year). Prior to NeoScene, all the black were crushed (no detail on the guy's dark suit, etc) and editing the native MOVs from the camera caused Premier Pro CS3 to crash constantly. Editing was a real pain. After converting to CFHD AVI files with NeoScene, the blacks were no longer crushed and editing was a breeze! No in-camera audio with this one, I added a music track. It's just a few clips thrown together.

Chinatown, Los Angeles (http://exposureroom.com/members/jyunte.aspx/assets/e85cb32ff7ed4d1eaa0456467a646680/)

Julian

Julian-- the video is very good ,very well done ,colours are great , good flow and smooth, only one spot gittered a bit.
You did an excellent job of editing parts together music suited very well.
Thanks
I apprecaite you telling the method 1-neo scene to convert the canon file to neo scene avi,then(2) you did the edit with adobe premiere cs3 then what format did you finish up with ,did you leave it avi ?

Stan kern

Stan,

I believe I used the following settings in Adobe Media Encoder:

Export Settings: Canon 5DMII Medium Res (H264)
(matching Vimeo and XBox 360 recommended format, 1280x720)
* Format: H.264
Filters:

Multiplexer:
* Basic Settings:
- Multiplexing: MP4,
- Stream Compatibility: iPod (IMPORTANT for Xbox 360 compatibility)

Video:
* Basic Video Settings:
- Codec: MainConcept H.264 Video,
- TV Standard: NTSC (I'm in the US)
- Frame Width [pixels]: 1280,
- Frame Height [pixels]: 720,
- Frame Rate [fps]: 30,
- Field Order: None (Progressive),
- Pixel Aspect Ratio: Square Pixels,
- Profile: High,
- Level: 3.1

* Bitrate Settings:
- Bitrate Encoding: VBR, 2 Pass (slower, but recommended)
- Target Bitrate [Mbps]: 6 (original 5DMII is at 38.6, BluRay 40, HD DVD around 36)
- Maximum Bitrate [Mbps]: 10

* Advanced Settings:
- Set Key Frame Distance: No

Audio:
* Audio Format Settings:
- Audio Format: AAC

* Basic Audio Settings:
- Codec: AAC,
- Output Channels: Stereo,
- Frequency: 44.1 kHz,
- Audio Quality: High

* Bitrate Settings:
- Bitrate [kbps]: 224 (your mileage may vary)

I got these from this post on Vimeo, Darts at Lark Tavern - Albany, NY - 08, Dec on Vimeo (http://www.vimeo.com/2641870).

Either that, or I used the following settings and set the bitrate to either 6000 or 8000 Mb/s.

Either way, it looks much better in HD, running on my own computer, as opposed to downsized and recompressed for the web! :-)

Julian

Ok i am using the try before you buy9will order shortly) neo scene and its working fine ,creating a neo scene avi file .
I also have sony vegas 8.0 for an edit,when i render or output the result what file format should i pick to get the best video results ,when this all settles i would like to save videos on dvd ie like some vacation shots .
Sorry to plague with simple questions but so far you're the only contact help i have ,canon smiled and told me my computer was to slow for 5d files and i should have a MAC

Someone with Sony Vegas experience will have to help you there. I've never used it, so I can't help, I'm afraid. You could always search for an answer in the Sony Vegas forum -- I'm sure it's been asked several dozen, million times!

Julian