I just turned away a bride who tried to strong arm me. I really wanted the job, because it is on a Friday in May, and their expectations were low, at least thats what I guessed.

I had offered her two cams for ceremony only for an embarrasing price, shot with HD.

Now mind you she was sent to me by a very enthusiastic customer who talks us up every chance she gets so we came highly recommended.

I sent the last quote to them, and they said they were about to go on a cruise and would decide when they return.

Just received their decision. If we couldn't come up with a better deal, they would have a friend do it.

I replied " I understand, if you need anything else please let me know".

This is the first time I have had a bride come out and say that. I must say it was disturbing.

You don't need client's like that. Move on to the next one...

Jeff,
when I have a potenial client say that (or similar) to me I basically tell them "great, good luck to you" and move on all the while thanking my lucky stars I did NOT book the job. While we all want the job to make the money sometimes NOT booking it is really the best thing to do. Ever have a B&G you live with forever? Or at least it seems like it.
If you already gave them a deal but reducing you normal price and they came back and demanded more, of course I would want to know what it is they wanted, but it is generally something unreasonable, so cut them loose and if you can't book someone else to fill the date then so be it.
I just really don't let it bother me. After all, you aren't going to book all of them all the time.
Some will, some won't, so what. Who's NEXT!
Don

Don't worry Jeff. I was feeling similar when I dropped customers referred by a friend. Just their expectations were much bigger for less money then I could agree for.

It'll pass as soon as you get another customer for the same weekend at your terms.

I sent the last quote to them, and they said they were about to go on a cruise and would decide when they return.

Just received their decision. If we couldn't come up with a better deal, they would have a friend do it.

Oh, they couldn't book with you unless you make no money, and yet they have the gall to tell you they're about to go on a cruise four months before their wedding. They're obviously poor.

Move on, and thank the stars you didn't pick up this grinder client.

Thanks guys.

Jeff,

You made the right decision. People think Wedding Videography is easy and Uncle Bob can do it, then by all means let them.

Jeff, I'm by all means not an expert on wedding videography, but sometimes we have the same problem with other clients.
Don't worry, you made the right decision.

If you would have lowered your price you would:
- earned basically nothing, or not enough.
- you would agree that every price you make is open for negotiation. With other words, if you would do it, that bride will tell her friends how cheap you are, and those friends will come to you with the same low price / high quality expectations.

You made the right choice, and in this business, people always think we can work for nothing. And our productions company has noticed that the more 'presents' you give a client (little extras you do free of charge that they didn't ask for to surprise them, etc. ...), the greedier they become, because they expect more and more for free, and if you at one moment say: "Sorry, but this will cost you extra.", suddenly they are with their arms up in the air. We've been through it too.
We made extra trailers for a company which they hadn't paid extra for. Instead of being happy, they said they liked it, but kept asking changes and changes to these trailers, and expecting to pay nothing for it. We made the changes they wanted, and then they would come back with other changes again, and there we said: "Sorry, but if you want that, I will have to charge, because I can't keep working at these - free - trailers for nothing." They suddenly thought it was expensive that we asked money to make some alterations to a trailer we had already changed a couple of times at their request.

Now, we learned not to give away 'presents' anymore for nothing, because we only get a wrong reaction.

On the short term, you maybe lost a client. But it was an unresonable client, and believe me, you are better of without those. The comment about the cruise just makes it harder to swallow.

J
On the short term, you maybe lost a client. But it was an unresonable client, and believe me, you are better of without those. The comment about the cruise just makes it harder to swallow.

I second that. Which reminded me of a Craig Ad, wanting a Videographer to shoot their wedding/edit for $ 300. Their selling point is you get to meet the photographer they hired possibly get business from him & what breaks me is they have their own wedding website to boost.

Hi Jeff,

I was just in the same situation not even a week ago. I had a client that was low balling me and they wanted everything and the moon for next to nothing. They told me that they would let me know of their decision by the end of the week. After losing a few hours of sleep for giving in so much i decided to send them an email to let them know that another couple was interested for the same date and they had picked a bigger package but i was allowing them to either match their price or i was forced to pass it along.

I haven't heard from them since.

I know at first you think you lost money by turing the client down but as others have mentioned if you start cutting deals with couples you'll become your own competitor which isn't a good idea at all.

See the positive side to this story is now i will have more time to work on the good paying customers who value the work i do.

I don't do weddings, but there is ONE TRUTH in video: No news spreads faster than the lowest price you've EVER charged, regardless of how early in your career it was, how much "in kind" you also received or how close the recipient of your good will was to you.

PS. That's not a "client"; you build a relationship with a client. That's a customer, at best...
PPS. That's not even a customer, that's a tire kicker.

i just got the same thing, except for photography. they were going to have a friend shoot everything else except for group shots, told them sorry, my half day package is the lowest I offer. see ya!

All in all, especially after your feedback, I do feel better. A few weeks ago I raised my rates a couple of hundred dollars, and my conversion rate is same as before I did.

I've been complaining all year about my backlog of edits, and part of the reason I raised my prices was to slow things down a bit.

It is so true that that kind of client is usually the most difficult also. More and more I'm glad she's moved on.

I tend to offer discounts for Fridays, but that is only contributing to the problem of the backlog. It sure did last year.

Ok... maybe I should make a separate thread for this... but does anyone have something like a top 10 list of reasons a B&G shouldn't let Uncle Bob do their wedding videography? Educating the B&G's before the DEAL OR NO DEAL PHASE can't hurt.

Maybe my story doesn't fit in this category as B&G's never really threatened me to say "lower your rate or we won't book you", but I still feel like sharing. I had two potential clients that were interested in booking me, one of whom actually confirmed (and was going to have their wedding on a small cruise too), but I didn't meet them to sign a contract or take a deposit.

Both said they were on a budget, both later said they were going to have family members do it and not hire me because of their low budget.

Months later, I stumble upon other wedding videographer websites and what do I see? They're wedding video highlights with those same potential clients. They were with different videographers with rates much higher than mine. I'll admit, they probably produce higher quality videos than I can, but that didn't seem to be a concern to them.

How's THAT for disturbing?

I hear what you're saying Scott, but I really only offer that kind of advice to customers if the opportunity arises or it comes up. Most, not all will see it as me trying to protect my turf. Those kind of people usually don't learn except for the hard way, until it's too late. the ones that need to hear it most are the ones that don't trust vendors anyway and always feel suspicious of motives.

One videographer in our area has a page dedicated to why you shouldn't let uncle Bob do it, and it is well written. Actually that wouldn't be a bad thing to incorporate on my site.

Wow, Chris. I understand how timid people can be and afraid of being honest, but that kind of lying really bothers me.

It is important for me at this point to reaffirm (for myself) most of my clients are great. I have at times become discouraged by the kind of behaviour we are discussing, but in the end it is a good business, most of the time.

Wow, Chris. I understand how timid people can be and afraid of being honest, but that kind of lying really bothers me....

I actually had one last year tell me that her fiance got in a fight with her parents and the wedding was off. Then I came across her personal networking page (i don't remember if it was Myspace, Facebook or...) on a later occasion and saw that she got married on time, had "uncle bob" do the wedding and had posted a blog about how the audio sucked and they couldn't figure out how to get it out of movie maker on to DVD. Is it wrong that I felt kind of smug after reading that?

For the last year, I have been offering brides a "no bride turned away" option that we can get them something for their wedding no matter what and it has been helpful. That is not to say I am offering them 2 cam HDV ceremony and reception for $500 but if they can honestly only afford $500 then I offer maybe a 1 cam ceremony only pkg and then give them upsell options. It has worked well because they feel like they are ala carte-ing the pkg they want and often can talk an aunt and uncle into paying a portion of their videography as a present. I have had many of the "strong arm" brides in the past come around with this approach. You tell me what you can afford and I will tell you what that can get you and somewhere in the middle we compromise or part ways.

Maybe my story doesn't fit in this category as B&G's never really threatened me to say "lower your rate or we won't book you", but I still feel like sharing. I had two potential clients that were interested in booking me, one of whom actually confirmed (and was going to have their wedding on a small cruise too), but I didn't meet them to sign a contract or take a deposit.

Both said they were on a budget, both later said they were going to have family members do it and not hire me because of their low budget.

Months later, I stumble upon other wedding videographer websites and what do I see? They're wedding video highlights with those same potential clients. They were with different videographers with rates much higher than mine. I'll admit, they probably produce higher quality videos than I can, but that didn't seem to be a concern to them.

How's THAT for disturbing?

Ouch. Ouch....

Maybe my story doesn't fit in this category as B&G's never really threatened me to say "lower your rate or we won't book you", but I still feel like sharing. I had two potential clients that were interested in booking me, one of whom actually confirmed (and was going to have their wedding on a small cruise too), but I didn't meet them to sign a contract or take a deposit.

Both said they were on a budget, both later said they were going to have family members do it and not hire me because of their low budget.

Months later, I stumble upon other wedding videographer websites and what do I see? They're wedding video highlights with those same potential clients. They were with different videographers with rates much higher than mine. I'll admit, they probably produce higher quality videos than I can, but that didn't seem to be a concern to them.

How's THAT for disturbing?

well......maybe the other guy did a huge cut for that couple....

Just earlier today I got this email:

Hi Ger,
I am just wondering if you can do any better on price, I have had two offers of under 1000 for a similar package that you are offering.
Let me know if you can do anything
Regards xyxyx

This woman has already paid her deposit, just the other day.

I replied:

Hi xyxyx,
Sorry xyxyxy but that is my price. There are other video guys doing things cheaper.
There always will be. But with the experience and standards I have I must charge more.
It wouldn't make sense for me with the finished product I achieve to charge in par with
the low end videographer.I encourage you to look at some samples online of these guys work and then look at mine. If you genuinely see no difference and want to cancel your booking I will return your deposit. Please inform me of your intentions within the next 48hrs.
Otherwise I will assume you are sticking with myself.
Thanks,
Gerard.

I honestly wouldn't lose a minutes sleep if she asks for it back. Will let ye know.

I had a bride come to our office and talk to us about shooting her wedding. We ended up being out of her budget and she said she was going to have her uncle do it. This wasn't a threat or jab, she was seriously close to going over budget and still had stuff to do. Jump ahead about 9 months at a bridal show. That same bride walked over to my booth with one of her bridesmaids that was getting married. She told me that what her uncle shot looked horrible. In my head I'm thinking, "what did you expect"? She told her friend that she would have booked us if she could have afforded it. Her bridesmaid ended up booking.

If we ever have a couple that seems like they are teetering back and forth, we sometimes will offer a honeymoon/baby picture montage for their DVD. This has pulled a few couples back to booking us. As for the ones that seem like they are going to be problems, they probably are. Cut your losses now and start looking for someone else to fill that date.

When people ask for discounts, it almost feels like an insult. We all work hard at what we do and we charge accordingly. We will sometimes give discounts for a Sunday wedding or something in August/September (hurricane season for Ethan and myself). If that won't cut it, we will be more than happy to suggest someone else to shoot your wedding.

Just earlier today I got this email:

Hi Ger,
I am just wondering if you can do any better on price, I have had two offers of under 1000 for a similar package that you are offering.
Let me know if you can do anything
Regards xyxyx

This woman has already paid her deposit, just the other day.

I replied:

Hi xyxyx,
Sorry xyxyxy but that is my price. There are other video guys doing things cheaper.
There always will be. But with the experience and standards I have I must charge more.
It wouldn't make sense for me with the finished product I achieve to charge in par with
the low end videographer.I encourage you to look at some samples online of these guys work and then look at mine. If you genuinely see no difference and want to cancel your booking I will return your deposit. Please inform me of your intentions within the next 48hrs.
Otherwise I will assume you are sticking with myself.
Thanks,
Gerard.

I honestly wouldn't lose a minutes sleep if she asks for it back. Will let ye know.

Thats a spot on letter and a spot on attitude.

When I hear that "Uncle Bob" is filming the weddng, I ask the bride, "and is "Uncle Joe" taking the photos"?

Thanks Steve,
I think so, this approach works for me. I wont allow anyone to tell me what Im worth. Ill tell them.
I still havent heard from her and its been nearly 48hrs. I assume at this stage shes sticking with me.

The annoying thing about it is that they are very quick to assume the guys offering it for cheaper are every bit as good at it as you are. The only 2 deciding factors for some of these people is how much it costs and for how long the videog stays.
We'll educate them as we go. There's a change on the horizon I feel. The quality coming from some videogs is getting very good.
Uncle Bob wont get a look in.

I have the luxury of turning away whomever I want because I have other sources of income (I know some don't). I love working with couples that like to work with us, if that makes any sense.

We try and be very selective with who we will work with because there is nothing worse that spending that much time with a couple you don't "Click" with.

I wouldn't feel the least bit bad about turning away that bride.

I had a client contact me the other week, she had seen my site and liked my videos. Then the conversation went like this:

her: "Have you seen xxs's website?"
me: "Yes, I have, I like his work"
her: "Yes, he was my first choice but he's booked for my wedding date"
me: "er...oh dear"
her: "Can you make your videos like his, specifically the bit where..."

..and then she proceeded to describe in excrutiating detail the other guys work and if I can replicate it.

From when she mentioned 'he was my first choice' I got the hump (maybe wrongly so) and lost interest. I was actually quite insulted even though she had stated she liked my stuff. Like most of us here, I take pride in my work and dont want to play second fiddle to anyone.

Customers who choose on budget, OK, money is a concern for almost everyone and If I like the couple and feel they're genuine I'll maybe give a small discount. But this bride made it clear with her words and tone of voice that "You'll have to do"

She wanted to book me and I politely declined by giving an astronomical quote.

her: "Can you make your videos like his, specifically the bit where..."

You did right thing.

I went once into this trap. Oh, man, never again.

Client came to me and showed a dvd of their friends wedding. She said she wants exactly the same opening sequence like the other couple had, and some more things. She new very well all little details (i.e. amount of slow-mo or b&w). I agreed.

Then all the issues started after the wedding. She wanted to see every little piece of dvd before finalizing. I put twice as much work as for regular wedding and got paid the same. I never realized that at the booking - I should have charged them arm and leg.

The video came out great, the couple was very happy, but I said to myself - never again. If somebody doesn't like my style, then move on. No need for headaches.

dan, i had this happen to me, except I was first choice, and mistakenly told the couple
i was booked when I wasn't. so, they found someone whose work was close to mine
and asked him if he could include some of my style in his work. He ended up calling me
to ask me stuff, and I ended up helping shoot, and editing a short form version of the wedding. We have been working together ever since, and it has turned out to be
one of the best things for both of us, thanks to this client who just wanted the best
video he could get.

Maybe it's just me, but my feeling is this. First as a solo operator when I'm booked I'm booked-first in with paperwork and money gets the date, regardless. Second, a potential client either likes my work or they don't and they either like, or at least agree to, my price or they don't. I tend to keep things simple. Over the years I've had every one of these situations mentioned above. My answer, "Fine if you feel that uncle Bob can do the job, great. Enjoy you special day and thank you for your interest."
I had a couple ask about someone elses style about 5 years ago, "We really wanted him but he was booked,can you do the video like him?" My answer was a very simple "No. I'm not him, and he's not me. His style is his and mine is mine. Sorry but thanks for the interest. Enjoy your special day"
Now while this may sound like I can afford to pass on jobs let me say that NO I am not rich so like everyone else, every job counts and like everyone else I am not totally inflexible and I will do things in editing that I might normally not do and YES I will work with them on pricing within REASON BUT...I am not going to try to be someone else nor will I cut my price by 30 or more % to book the job nor will I play games once the job is booked or shot.
I guess I'm just a grumpy old man who has been burned a few times over the last 25 going on 26 years inthe business and i don't take it anymore. You hired me for my style, my price, the quality of my work and yes maybe even my personality or at least some combination of the 3. LET ME DO MY JOB! You know the one YOU HIRE ME TO DO!
Again I'm not inflexible but only within reason and I never and I mean NEVER lose sleep over a client. I lose enough sleep on my own.
Use common sense keep you ethics high and it'll always work out right.
Don

Well said Don.
I have it in my contract that creative content is at the discretion of the videographer.
Once a bride asked me on the day if she could have creative input in the editing process.
I didn't know what to say. I actually said ' ah, no, that sounds a bit dodgy ' and the groom burst out laughing.

Well said Don.
I have it in my contract that creative content is at the discretion of the videographer.
Once a bride asked me on the day if she could have creative input in the editing process.
I didn't know what to say. I actually said ' ah, no, that sounds a bit dodgy ' and the groom burst out laughing.

dodgy...........
what would be the replacement word we'd use here in the U.S. to make the groom burst out laughing?

dodgy...........
what would be the replacement word we'd use here in the U.S. to make the groom burst out laughing?

Flaky, dicey...

I suppose 'Risky', although Im not sure would it carry the same emphasis which is that it could be very very difficult to put up with her. I wouldn't recommend ever talking so directly to a client anyway. I regretted it as soon as i said it as there was a chance she could have taken offence.

EDIT: yea what Vito just said.

As the original poster here I am happy to report the bride that I politely turned away came back, had her fiance call the other day to say she was mailing a deposit and contract.

She apparently was too sheepish to call herself, which I can understand.

We'll see how it plays out.

Awesome, Jeff. Good to get a sales conversion and stick to your guns.