Hey y´all

here copied in, are my bits n bobs from the thread "EX3 software glitch",

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/sony-xdcam-ex-cinealta/137649-ex3-software-glitch.html

which seams to have gotten lost along the way, I will in future name my threads appropriately.....


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1)
I have experienced a "software glitch" 3 times in the first 2 weeks of having my EX3,
all to do with the lens..

on my first shooting day, after powering up for the umpteenth time, I was unable to pull focus, no matter what I tried, it just wouldn´t work.........

Later on in the same shoot, I attached my Bebop ZOE remote and it had absolutely no effect on the lens at all.

the 3rd time was a few days later, I had the problem with the focus again...

Every time I had one of these "glitches", powering down and back up seemed to solve the issue.

I have done quite alot of shooting over the past few weeks and have not had any more of these problems.

The Tech support from SONY reckon it was just a "SOFTWARE GLITCH".

anyone else had anything like this?
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2
Thanks for the replies

first of all to answer "stupid question",
No I wasn´t on auto focus, as I never shoot anything in auto mode, I don´t really like it when the cam does the thinking for me.

Also as some others have reported, they had a similar problem, but their cams were overheating at the time.
I was shooting up on a glacier at the time and my cam wes definately not overheating.
The 2nd time the focus problem occured, I was just testing out S&Q motion with my kids out in the garden at around 10°c, once again no overheating.

I called the PrimeSupport in the UK, who said it´s just a "SOFTWARE GLITCH, continue shooting with the cam and if it happens again, get in touch with us.....",
I then asked them for a contact in Germany, who I could go and see and get it checked out...
They gave me number in Cologne, who then directed me to SONY in Munich.
I took it to get checked out and was pretty horrified to note that the dude who claimed to be a "specialist" didn´t even know how to power the cam up.
He started telling me that the camera is really just a computer and that the software had probably not booted up properly.
Then he did a few tests with the focus and noticed that the auto-focus button didn´t work, what he didn´t notice, was that he was in Full Manual focus mode.
He also mistook the zoom ring for the focus ring and faught against the zoom mechanics trying to pull focus, at which time I took the cam from him and politely informed him of his lack of expertise and left, feeling rather taken for an idiot, what do these people think we are doing with these cams?
I for one am not just shooting my family hollidays.........

Not too sure about the "software Glitch" claim from SONY and if it is a software issue, it shouldn´t really be happening to cams that are costing 8 grand €´s, or am I the only one who sees it this way?

Having to power down and back up is a right pain in the @$$.
I don´t generally have the chance to redo the take while shooting events or live stuff.
------------------------------------------


So we gotta make ourselves heard on this one.
I can´t claim to be very impressed by the lack of support here and am not keen to part with my cam for a few weeks while it is sent in, it will mean business lost.....

As I stated earlier in this thread, maybe we should get a petition going, with a list of names and adresses of the people who are experienceing this problem.
There are going to be many more than just those who know about and use this forum.
so we should put out a web-link, which will lead here for everyone who punches in EX3.
I´m a shooter, not a webmaster, so I have no idea how that could be done.....

Typically, the "Software Glitch" will not rear it´s ugly head when you want to prove it to someone, but rather when you least expect it and it has the best chance of giving you heart failure.

there can be no excuse for this kind of technical error, even if the thing had cost 500 bucks instead of 8500.

I´m not happy

Everything is pointing towards a software problem. Until new firmware issued that addresses the problem is issued, the problem won't be fixed.

I am going to start documenting my shooting so when the problem occurs, I will know how long the camera has been on, what focus mode I am in or if I have moved from say manual to assisted manual, note all the other settings when possible like frame rates, shutter speed/mode, white balance mode, TLCS settings, whether macro mode is being used or any other function that could play into focusing the unit (from a software perspective).

Once I do that I am going to call up our local Sony service center to find out if they are working on the matter and then find out who best to send the "crash log" to at Sony.

On the topic of the hidden usb port....yes it is located under the plastic cover where the shoulder support unscrews. I have verified with my own eyes.

Mr. Stone, I think it´s a good idea to start documenting every error that occurs with the EX-3. If we all started to report these things when they happened, after awhile Sony couldn´t ignore the amount of reports. We just need to decide WHERE to send these reports?

Mr. Wilkinson, I totally agree, we can´t send in our camcorders without any clear understanding of what to expect in return. If anyone takes the leap of faith and sends the EX-3 in for service, please let us know how it goes. Thank you!

It really bugs me that I have to complain about a camera, which is excellent when it works like it´s suppose to do. Potential EX-3 customers might be turned away from the product by the way this thread is developing. That´s a shame. The EX-3 deserves better than this. Any thoughts about contacting Fujinon (which has produced the lens)?

-terje

Sony supplied our cameras and our guarantees / support agreements are directly with Sony. They will deal internally with Fujinon as required to resolve this - if that's what's required to solve this fault. Our contract is with Sony and it is they who people should contact.

I agree that the bad press this is starting to generate for the EX3 will no doubt "worry" Sony into actively finding a solution sooner rather than later....GOOD!!!! After all, who does not Google "Item X", in this case EX3, followed by "problems" or "issues" to see what's out there on the web when spending this much cash....I certainly always do! BTW, this thread currently comes up about 4th on the first Google search results page with "EX3" and "Problems" as keywords. Creative Cow's thread is 3rd. It's that easy to know about it.

I remember well the vignetting and back focus issues that seemed to plague the introduction of the EX1 being whipped up into what seemed like a web frenzy with lots of posts about it on every forum one could find concerning video cameras (by people who had bought an EX1 and lots who hadn't.... and maybe then did not). This no doubt gave Panasonic / Canon / JVC etc. a few more sales as a result. In the current climate, Sony can't let that happen again.

So come on Sony. I'm sure you read these types of threads on here. What's the plan forward?

I'm going to have to take my EX3 back for a replacement tomorrow. I can't get the Fb adjust to work no matter what I try. Sometimes I turn the camera on and the zoom will go one way but not the other, or it will go fast one direction but only go slowly in reverse.

I am also having the issue of the manual focus sometimes working and sometimes not. I think I've got a real dud here! Unfortunately it seems from reading around that I am not alone. There appears to be one heck of a lot of people having these same issues all over the world.

Sorry to hear that Simon. Let us know how you get on. What a shame that your first experience with this camera has been so disappointing.

I should have known better than to put the box up in the attic! I think I doomed myself to a dud when I did that!

Well, if you can get it back in the origami puzzle that is that packaging (and exactly how it arrived) you'd be a star. I'm convinced it's almost impossible to do!

Maybe Sony designed it like that to discourage returns!

Simon, I don´t think your attic is at fault. If so, your attic must contain a hell of a lot of boxes... (even my box!) ;-) No, no, Sir! This one is on Sony for sure. Please let us hear how it goes? And please try to get some info from your service partner about other users having the same problem. When I talked to the local Sony representative he insisted that he never had heard about "my" problem before. He even checked the report status in Europe (at least that´s what he said) and couldn´t find many EX-3s that had been on service. Amazing, isn´t it?

So where can we send our complaint? If we can get a few hundred users to sign, maybe Sony would react?

The best of luck with your EX-3, Simon!

-terje

Right, the good news is that after going to the local football stadium and ripping down their floodlights for me to shine on my BF chart I finally managed to get the Auto FB adjust thing to work! It took a fair few goes though because while it kept giving me an "OK" message the focus was still ever so slightly off when I tried a creep zoom to test it on a large monitor.

I think I've nailed that little gremlin now. But that still doesn't solve the issue of manual focus sometimes not working. The issue with the zoom servo seems to be behaving itself now that the backfocus is done. However I still don't trust it. I'm going to be testing the bollocks off it tonight to see if it remember the backfocus setting and to see if I still get any issues. This camera is going to have to earn my trust big time, and at the moment it is on probation.

On probation? Really? It seems that you´ve be quite unfortunate in your purchase, even compared to most people here in this thread. Keep us posted about your findings, Simon!
And best of luck with the trust-earning project...

-terje

Having posted claim (in which I also made reference to this thread) to Sony Via mail on their support site last night, I recieved a phonecall from the UK this morning to find out what the problem is.( I´m impressed)

The girl said she´d pass my claim on to the Techies here in Germany.

she also gave me a German phone number, in case I wanted to get in touch with someone local.

I´ll call when I have a gap, if they don´t call me first.

Kenny, that´s very good news. Please do inform Sony about the rest of us as well. This is an issue thy should take seriously. We want tools, not toys!
I´m looking forward to hear how it goes. Best of luck!

-terje

SO....
I called the German techie´s this morning 11:30 and was told that they don´t have anything to do with the EX3............and that any EX3 problems are dealt with in France.
The guy I spoke to however was pretty concerned and really wanted to help.
He took my details and the serial no. of my cam and said he´d pass them on..........

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(17:00)
I just got a call from another girl in the UK, who said that she´d organise a pick-up for my cam. UPS will arrive with packaging material etc. on thursday.
If the driver has the time and I am around, he can take it with him straight away.
normally he would return the following day to pick up once I´ve had a chance to package it all safely.

She did say that there is new firmware coming from Japan soon, but is not sure what exactly it is supposed to fix.

I told her about this thread, but she said that they aren´t allowed to use any information from internet forums..............

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(17:22)
just got another call from the same girl, she has just spoken to the product manager of the EX series.
he informed her and she informed me that the firmware will be fixing the problem with the focus and that it should be out in the next few days..........

what she couldn´t tell me is how exactly we get the new fimware and whether we´ll be able to load it up ourselves.........(they haven´t recieved instructions yet)
It apparently wasn´t possible to do it ones-self with the EX1.
She said she´d call me personally as soon as she knows more about the firmware and whether my cam will need to go in or not.

in the meantime, she gave me the option of having the packaging sent to me, so it can all happen fast if the cam does need to go in for the upgrade.

so for the moment my cam will stay with me.

glad to be getting some answers though.

Great info. Thanks Kenny.

Kenny, I´m really happy to hear that Sony is responding the way they do, and thanks for sharing. Hopefully you´ll have something to report back in a week or two? Best of luck with your EX-3!

-terje

On probation? Really? It seems that you´ve be quite unfortunate in your purchase, even compared to most people here in this thread. Keep us posted about your findings, Simon!
And best of luck with the trust-earning project...

Well, I got my replacement EX3 no questions asked from H Prestons. They really bent over backwards for me the last couple of days despite being totally overrun by Christmas orders and whatever else. I can't thank them enough.

Anyway, the new camera, touch wood, appears to be behaving itself. I received a couple of new Kensington 7 in 1's, just waiting for some cards I ordered. Though I intend to order some additional Express adaptors from our Aussie mate in a couple of weeks.

I think I might sell my J17 while it can still get something and get a decent 2/3" HD lens that I can use on both my 510 and the EX3.

Simon, you got a replacement camera? That´s great! I hope it´ll turn out just fine. I guess the different countries (or dealers?) have their own strategy on how to deal with warrenty issues? I probably have to spend $ 500-800 to send the EX-3 in. I made the stupide decision to buy the EX-3 while visiting New York. Not all decisions are made in heaven. Apparently.

-terje

just got another call from the same girl... she informed me that the firmware will be fixing the problem with the focus and that it should be out in the next few days...what she couldn´t tell me is how exactly we get the new firmware and whether we´ll be able to load it up ourselves... She said she´d call me personally as soon as she knows.

Great news Kenny. We thank you for being so diligent.

Simon, you got a replacement camera? That´s great! I hope it´ll turn out just fine. I guess the different countries (or dealers?) have their own strategy on how to deal with warrenty issues? I probably have to spend $ 500-800 to send the EX-3 in. I made the stupide decision to buy the EX-3 while visiting New York. Not all decisions are made in heaven. Apparently.

-terje

NY? You're not the only one. But in my defense, at the time, there was nowhere in the Caribbean to buy an EX3 (not sure that there is now either). Now based in Yorkshire, England for the moment.

Kenny, your update gives me renewed hope that this focusing issue will be resolved soon. Hopefully Sony will trust EX users to update their own firmware from now on.

Jus.

Simon, any sign of this focus glitch with your new (replacement) EX3?

I have been told by a Sony source that EX3s will be shipping from the factory in the new year with updated firmware that clears up various issues.

Simon, any sign of this focus glitch with your new (replacement) EX3?

In fact yes. It happened to me once the other day. I was trying to get a close up of something and it just stopped me being able to focus so I had to turn it off then on again.

I suppose that is the drawback of having a choice between manual and infinite servo style focussing. There can never be a true mechanical connection. The only failsafe solution is to use additional Fuji and Canon 1/2" lenses.

Hopefully the new firmware will be available to all.

Any sign of the alleged firmware update yet?

Don´t think we should hold our breath untill after new years to be honest.....

This camera does a lot of fantastic things. I've got one on loan from Sony right now as an evaluation product... but this problem has been enough of a pain in my rump to make me very wary of purchasing them. The whole way the focus thing is set up on this unit is a bit dodgy, but I can't even get used to using it when it just stops working entirely all the time.

Hopefully this will get resolved. Soon.

I would... but mine was already off. My EX3's 'senior moment' occurred after changing between manual and auto focus on the ring. Rebooting restored the function but sheesh... suppose I was in the middle of a shot!

That said, still loving this thing. Haven't quite got around to having an EX3 tattoo on my shoulder but I'm not far off...

Jus.

I agree! I love what I've seen of this thing, but this is too major of a problem to ignore. I've noticed that sometimes when you reboot it, the white balance goes completely wonky. Had to white balance three times in the middle of the shoot because of it, so it's not JUST the inconvenience of the reboot, unfortunately.

I do, however, think I'm going to take this LCD/viewfinder combo out on a date. Maybe propose. Have kids and the whole works.

OK, Mine is going in
I got a call from the Prime support people today,
the new firmware is out, but the camera needs to be sent in to have it uploaded.
Public holiday tomorrow, so packaging gets dropped off on wednesday, if I´m lucky, he´ll take the cam with straight away and I´ll beat the crowds.....

I´ll keep you all updated as I can

I dug around on sony's pro website, but dont see where the list the firmware updates. is there a place I can look at what the new firmware is going to address (aside from the focus issue)?

So far so good.

As promised my cam was picked up by UPS yesterday (wed 07.01.09) at 14:30.

The provided packaging was not exactly what I thought it´d be, but did the job.....
The driver was kind enought to wait the few minutes it took me to package the unit, even lending a hand to seal it up with tape.........

not a nice feeling watching my 8,5 grand €´s boxed up and leaving, but I suppose that is the way SONY wants it.......

it is supposed to take about a week, so I expect it will be returned with the sparkly new firmware update installed in the middle of next week.

one thing I don´t like about the whole issue, is that the girl from Prime Support said that she doesn´t think that SONY gives loaners for firmware upgrades.(normal policy is that one can get a loaner if `repairs´will take more than a week)
as far as I´m concerned, this is a repair

I have timed it so I can do without the cam for a week and a few days, but have set a deadline, as I have a shoot coming up and don´t wanna have to rent...

Sony US is saying that there is no official release yet, only an internal version.

But once again, it will require depot service, unless of course someone accidentally reveals the URL.

I got my cam back at 12:30 today monday 12 Jan
That went really fast...
considering, it had to go from here in Germany to Paris and that there was a weekend in between
the initial testing I have done has been fine and the cam is behaving very well.

If any of you are considering sending your cams in, make sure to do a camera data backup before doing so, mine came back without any of my original settings stored, fortunately I did think this would be the case in advance.

looks like I beat the crowds (o;

Kenny can you please tell us what is your new firmware version number?

Did they tell you what other things if any has been affected with this upgrade (apart from the focus issue)? Thanks

Great news Kenny! Look forward to hearing more details soon.

I was on a big corporate shoot today in Cambridge and had some macro work to do in a rush....and was hesitant to go there but did it anyway - and the camera behaved perfectly then and afterwards.

I've only ever seen this loss of focus issue twice on mine - still can't work out why some seem to get it frequently and others like me only rarely. BTW, this was after 4 hrs shooting so the EX3 was definitely warmed up.

Those of you who have the firmware upgrade....

Can you still shoot on SDHC (MxR) fine? I suspect so, as I don't know how they could prevent that while retaining the hard drive capability, but just thought I'd ask as I'm a little nervous about it.

I got my cam back at 12:30 today monday 12 Jan
That went really fast...
considering, it had to go from here in Germany to Paris and that there was a weekend in between
the initial testing I have done has been fine and the cam is behaving very well.
e.

looks like I beat the crowds (o;

Have you tested it with any 3rd party media cards since the update? I wonder if Sony wants to end the use of 3rd party media cards with the EX series.

Sorry guys, my testing has only been done with the SONY SxS cards, as I don´t have any others.....

Also not sure how to check which firmware version I have, if someone could enlighten me, I´ll check it out.....

As I didn´t get any written info with the return of the cam, I am not sure what other issues the new firmware covers, just happy that the focus issue is sorted.

Those of you who have the firmware upgrade...Can you still shoot on SDHC (MxR) fine?

I am taking my camera in today. Will report back.

Andy,

I appreciate it. I'd like to get my camera sent in soon, but not at the cost of losing the ability to record to SDHC.

Good news Ted. I got my EX3 firmware flashed (upgraded) on January 13th, from what was in the camera, version 1.02 to the new version, 1.03 and the camera has worked flawlessly since. I have put about 4 hours of record time on the camera using the SxS cards for the first 10 minutes and then SDHC cards using the Kensington adapter in one slot and the Delkin in the other. The SD cards I was using were the Sandisk Ultra 2 16gigers in both slots.

I wasn't horribly systematic or exhaustive in the way that I tested but I tried to go through torture tests and typical kinds of shooting that would cause the SDHC cards to fail.

The test probably most are interested in is the overcranking one. I shot as 720/24p at 48 frames several times without incident and then shot at 60 frames and it puked after a couple of minutes. All very typical from what we have experienced in the past using the SDHC cards. All this was done at the Sony Service Center before I left with the recently flashed EX3.

Since then, both that evening and today I have done about four hours of run & gun kind of shooting and it behaved well. No dropouts or media errors. I brought the material into Final Cut and see no aberations beyond codec limitations.

I am confident Sony has not compromised the ability to use SDHC cards with the USB/Express Card adapters and have no regrets about doing the firmware upgrade.

Thanks Andy for the update. All good to know :-)

Interestingly, on another thread on here someone posted that "Sony East Coast USA" are apparently not discussing the existence of this new Firmware with customers - but we all now know otherwise.....Very strange!

Here's part two of what I have to report.

I had two illuminating conversations with people at Sony Canada. One calling in to find out about the existence of the firmware and do some general recon in order to determine the amount of risk I was placing my camera in when getting the firmware update. Like pretty much everyone here, although people are not saying much, we don't want the firmware to sqaush the ability to use SDHC cards for garden variety shooting needs.

Well in my first chat with someone in technical services I asked them about the firmware update and what sort of bug fixes the software was going to fix. He paraphrased the techsheet they had on the firmware (version 1.03, issued December 24th, 2008) update stating it was going to address the focus response when MF assist was engaged and deal with a bug relating to the IR Remote when the + button is used. So I said "Does the firmware update remove the ability to use the SD card hack?" Without missing a beat he said "No!" He moved on immediately to speaking about something else but later on he qualified his statement by saying it wasn't on the bug fix list. Finally I asked the gentleman if there was a charge for the firmware upgrade and he said "No not for bug fixes."

At that point I decided I was going to do it as I was in an adventurous mood and I had a potentially long shoot coming up where the camera would be on without pause for a few hours with lots of moving in and out on subjects talking in a panel/forum format. As you can imagine that is an ideal situation for the focus ring to lock up after half an hour of shoot time.

So I managed the following business day to get in touch with someone at Sony Canada on the West Coast where I live to arrange taking the EX3 in for the upgrade. I explained that I lived on an island and would ideally like to get the camera firmware flashed the same day I brought it in as it would take a lot of time and money for me to shuttle back and forth a couple of times to do this. They said "No problem. The EX3 firmware update is a priority for us so we intend to offer people same day turnaround service on this as long as people can phone in advance to set up a day. You have to bring it in first thing though as it takes a few hours to do the whole process." I then asked if there was a charge for this and that individual said "No it will be done free of charge for this update."

Next day. I phone in at 9:30 and leave a voicemail with my contact and arrive around 10:45, signed the paperwork and was told to come back towards the end of the day but it might be done around 2:30 pm. I went jonesin' around some of my favorite stores ended up in music department first checking out some sweet grand pianos & synths and then some sheet music. At that point I was getting quite bummed as I was looking at some Debussy... just shaking my head at the level of difficulty when my phone rings! "Your camera is ready for pickup!" I look at my watch. It's around 1 pm.

I beetle out and thank the receptionist profusely while I am furioiusly jamming in SD cards into the slots wondering if the cameras stealth ability has been nuked. "Do you mind if I just test out the camera here in the foyer, just to make sure the firmware took properly?" "No problem. Go ahead. I did the overcranking as I mentioned in the previous post and was convinced by the similarity of the way it was responding that all was well and I could leave.

I phoned back a few minutes later to talk to the individual and thank them for the level of service they had brought forward and they had done the right thing as there were/are a fair number of EX3 owners who are upset about the focus issue. That person agreed but carefully navigated around talking about that specific issue (can't blame them). I stated that the other reason I was calling back was to get some really clear answers on Sony Canada's position on the "free" nature of this upgrade and that my intention was to post this information on an EX3 forum that many/most of the EX3 owners internationally read. She said that Sony Canada has made a formal decision to do this upgrade at no cost to the owner and that it is a priority. Meaning in the West Coast office that they will do the upgrade as quickly as is possible as long as arrangements are made in advance so they can accomodate our schedules be they short or whatever. I repeated myself asking if it was OK for me to state this publicly and the answer was "Yes."

I mentioned that other Sony divisions in other countries were not following this course and I commended the individual that Sony Canada is doing the right thing in keeping these kind of customers happy. I also said making it a priority was smart due to the focus issue as I am sure Sony doesn't want this problem hanging around.

Finally, and it should be obvious to most. The camera has to go into one of Sony's service depots. In Canada there are only 3. One in Montreal, one is Toronto and the other in Coquitlam, a burb of Vancouver.

Can someone enlighten me please about this issue - I have never encountered it yet (after 3 months of operation) but I always keep the focus in full manual mode (no MF assist) and have never used macro. On top of this I always shoot quite short shots, never exceeding 15 minutes in length at any one time. However I will be having a shoot very soon of over 1.5 hours of continuous shooting - without pausing.

Is this scenario a possible situation where I may encounter this issue? Thanks

It is debatable Brian (check previous posts you will see several setting scenarios where the issue has occurred) but I would say "yes" to your question.

I have never used MF assist and I had it lock up on me 3 times on long shoots just like what you describe.

Andy could you kindly indicate whether it locked up for you every time you had a long shoot or did it lock up for you on 3 times out of a number of long shoots? Basically I am trying to see whether it is an erratic symptom or a guaranteed symptom if one exceeds a certain recording time.

Since I rarely shoot for long times I'm not eager to send my camera away for an upgrade - hence I need to have a clear picture on the probability of encountering such a problem in my case. thanks

Not every time and with an inconsistent frequency. In all instances I was not using macro or MF assist.

How I have managed with it since the problem became evident was to switch the camera off for a few seconds and then turn it back on during a redundant or off topic comment. I would use a cutaway audience shot or a dissolve to deal with the edit.

Mr. Stone, thank you for your detailed brief. It´s indeed appreciated. Hopefully your EX-3 will perform as it should from now on :-)

Best,
-terje