Canon Digital Learning Center - Sample EOS 5D Mark II Video: A Three Act Play (http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=2327)

Shows what the 5D can do at a wedding... with professional actors, lighting crews, and a controlled shooting environment. Other than that, it's exactly how we shoot on a wedding day.

Sarcasm aside, I love almost everything I've seen come out of this camera. Canon has done a wonderful job of allowing the first images we've seem from this camera to be professionally shot and not just some Joe Blow taking it out of the box and shooting shakey footage of his cat in horrible light. Masterful marketing.

I can see this camera working in our usual wedding workflow with a second shooter on scene rolling a traditional camera while the 5D is being setup properly for 5 or 6 money shots per location.

I'm waiting to see what Red announces with the Scarlet (announcement coming Nov. 13th). I'm hoping that Scarlet is close to the same quality but with more traditional controls and longer record times. If it is, I might just wait for it so I can shoot it as my main cameras and not have to worry about some of the workarounds of the 5D, but if it's release date is too far off, I might just get a 5D to play with in the mean time.

Then again with the economy on the precipice maybe I should just hold on to my money for a while... and bury it in the back yard.

Sorry that this post is all over the place... all these things have been on my mind lately.

Canon Digital Learning Center - Sample EOS 5D Mark II Video: A Three Act Play (http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=2327)

Shows what the 5D can do at a wedding... with professional actors, lighting crews, and a controlled shooting environment. Other than that, it's exactly how we shoot on a wedding day.

Sarcasm aside, I love almost everything I've seen come out of this camera. Canon has done a wonderful job of allowing the first images we've seem from this camera to be professionally shot and not just some Joe Blow taking it out of the box and shooting shakey footage of his cat in horrible light. Masterful marketing.

I can see this camera working in our usual wedding workflow with a second shooter on scene rolling a traditional camera while the 5D is being setup properly for 5 or 6 money shots per location.

I'm waiting to see what Red announces with the Scarlet (announcement coming Nov. 13th). I'm hoping that Scarlet is close to the same quality but with more traditional controls and longer record times. If it is, I might just wait for it so I can shoot it as my main cameras and not have to worry about some of the workarounds of the 5D, but if it's release date is too far off, I might just get a 5D to play with in the mean time.

Then again with the economy on the precipice maybe I should just hold on to my money for a while... and bury it in the back yard.

Sorry that this post is all over the place... all these things have been on my mind lately.

No problem Ethan - I was able to follow all your thoughts! :)

I'm looking forward to using the 5D MKII at receptions and moments during the day for some shallow DOF shots. I'm going to try mounting it onto a Glidecam at some point too, but I'm not too optimistic that it will work well! We'll see!

As far as Red Scarlet goes. I'm also interested in seeing this if THEY EVER GET IT TO MARKET. I was disappointed that they delayed their announcement of it a while ago and I'm starting to wonder what that would mean for support-related issues etc if I do end up picking up a Scarlet. I'm just leery when companies delay, delay and delay.

I see the 5D being a tripod jockey and not suited for stedicam work, but I'd love to see your experiments. I just think with the DOF on this thing that it'll operate more like our current HV20/Letus combo.

If you follow the history or the Red One, that thing made it to market a good bit later than most people had thought, but it's been fairly well received and seems to do a nice job. I'd imagine it'll be the same with Scarlet. She'll take a little while to get to market, but once she does she'll do well. I'd guess they've learned a thing or two in the development and shipping of their first camera and things will continue to improve with this new round of cameras. I do know that internally they're expecting Scarlet to be a hot seller and they've talked about being able to mass produce these things. Who knows what reality will hold.

Oh I'll get one, that's for sure. It's a great DSLR that just happens to take great video as well, but the Scarlet has the advantage of professional audio options, modular design, dual CF slots (for longer record times), 24P, over cranking, wi-fi control, the list goes on. And according to Jim, should be out shortly after NAB.

It will be interesting to see how many photographers will start adding some sort of video option to their packages.... if any. I know Nikon is moving the same direction as Canon as well.

It will be interesting to see how many photographers will start adding some sort of video option to their packages.... if any. I know Nikon is moving the same direction as Canon as well.

I just don't think one person can do both jobs well. Photo is photo, video is video. I know people keep thinking they'll somehow merge or the line will be blurred, but I just dont see it.

I completely agree. It definitely shows with the photographers in my area who also do video. You'll always be better at one than the other. That is why I'll never offer photography, even though I consider myself to be a good photographer and I have a nicer DSLR, lenses, and flash than almost all the photographers in my area. I'm sticking to what I do best... using my photo equipment on my kids and for vacations.

The exception to the rule would probably be for someone like stillmotion. From what I can tell they have dedicated photographers and dedicated cinematographers. I don't think they have anyone pulling double duty over there... I don't know, maybe I'm wrong.

The exception to the rule would probably be for someone like stillmotion. From what I can tell they have dedicated photographers and dedicated cinematographers. I don't think they have anyone pulling double duty over there... I don't know, maybe I'm wrong.

I don't think you are. Same company, different disciplines.

I don't think you are. Same company, different disciplines.

Huh? You don't think I am, what?

I don't know, maybe I'm wrong.

Andrew - that's what I was responding to.

oh, right right. i should have figured that one out.

Wow, that footage looks great, In fact I think it looks better than my Sony EX1. I'm thinking about jumping the Nikon ship and switching all of my photo gear with Canon.

I don't think you are. Same company, different disciplines.

While we have dedicated photographers and cinematographers, I've also shot photo for several weddings and done photo partially for many weddings. I would certainly gain a lot by being a full time photographer, but at the same time, I've also taken some of our better shots throughout the years.

John who does mostly photo has come along and helped with cinematography and done a great job. He has shots in some of our SDEs and trailers.

It certainly can be done, and it can be done well, but there isn't generally enough time to go around to shoot both mediums even with the same camera and, for many, it may mean doing one medium well and the other not so well.

P.

Its great to see what its capable of in a controlled situation. I can see drawbacks to try to shoot something like a wedding with the 5D in a real situation. Will be interesting to see if Canon will look at releasing a video camera with some of the same features, surely they would be planing something.

Nobody has mentioned the prospect of the photographers reaction on the day if you suddenly have a Canon DSLR in your hands. Most are already paranoid that we are selling frame grabs from video. This will send them over the edge!

I could see a good few throwing a hissy fit if this happens.

Cut to tog and videagrapher squaring up outside church.

I personally don't get the idea of using a 5D Mk II for a wedding. Yes, the image quality is awesome, but I would rather take the money and put it towards something else, like advertising or a HV20/Letus combo. Granted, the HV20/Letus has limitations, but at least there is another camera that you can set up at the ceremony or during speeches to give more coverage, rather than a piece of equipment you're just going to use for a few minutes.

That being said, I do get excited about the type of footage that the 5D Mk II can produce and do plan on savings my Coke cans to get one.

Re: photographers, I think it's funny that I am reading some photo forums where photographers are considering adding video to their photo packages. Considering how much talk their is among photographers being undercut by people with Rebels and D40s, it's funny that there are some that are trying to do the same to us.

It may be a blanket statement, but I can see there being tension with some photographers. Another reason I'd leave the 5D at home, since it's always one of the top priorities of mine to get along with other vendors.

Nobody has mentioned the prospect of the photographers reaction on the day if you suddenly have a Canon DSLR in your hands. Most are already paranoid that we are selling frame grabs from video. This will send them over the edge!

I could see a good few throwing a hissy fit if this happens.

Cut to tog and videagrapher squaring up outside church.

I agree, try convincing the Photog you brought a DSLR to take video, how would you feel if a Photog brings a Video Camera and say's he's using it to take stills. Works both ways.

there is NO threat from photographers using the 5d mkII...how can there be? they need to learn how to edit, they can't film multi-cam, the audio won't be good, they can only record for minutes at a time....the list goes on....

if the bride wants a short snippet of her putting her veil on in great visual clarity, then yes, they can offer that :)

Its great to see what its capable of in a controlled situation. I can see drawbacks to try to shoot something like a wedding with the 5D in a real situation. Will be interesting to see if Canon will look at releasing a video camera with some of the same features, surely they would be planing something.

With all the buzz surrounding the 5D's video capability Canon would be nuts not to incorporate this into a proper video camera. Granted, I'm a bit of a pessimist, but when they do introduce said camera I'm guessing we'll be asked to pay $5000+ for the "luxury" of good audio, proper manual control, and familiar design. Who knows, maybe they'll surprise us and not throw a hefty premium on it, I wouldn't complain about that.

You're probably right, Canon would be CRAZY not to migrate this technology into their video line. I'm not going to hold my breath however, I'm counting down the days until November 13's big announcement from RED.

You're probably right, Canon would be CRAZY not to migrate this technology into their video line. I'm not going to hold my breath however, I'm counting down the days until November 13's big announcement from RED.

With Red, it's a good idea not to hold your breath. It's the whole "change without notice" thing that'll getcha.

$5 says that the announcement will be some specs and a closeup 3D render that will leave you wondering what exactly you're looking at... is it a handle? or the camera?

there is NO threat from photographers using the 5d mkII...how can there be? they need to learn how to edit, they can't film multi-cam, the audio won't be good, they can only record for minutes at a time....the list goes on....

if the bride wants a short snippet of her putting her veil on in great visual clarity, then yes, they can offer that :)

But if I put myself in the photographers shoes, i can sell a small highlight video package as an add on for $1500 and hire someone to edit the thing for $400-$500. Outsource your weakness.

Outsource your weakness.

That's a nice little nugget of sound advice.

I don't see the limitations of the new Canon... OK, it's 30P, but a darn fine 30P... OK, it's got a 30 minute time cap, after which you can restart immediately with a new card... OK, so it's got shallow DOF, I presume that by choosing different lenses and aperatures you can control this and I'd rather have the shallow DOF easily accessable with a lens swap than having to dial in a twitchy rig... maybe I don't understand the DOF adapters, but seems to me the Canon pretty well covers what they do...


In my mind the concept of a dual use camera has advantages and disadvantages - I'm using the SR11 and CX12 - both pretty darn good dual use cams, and the CX actually has a "smile shutter" that does the photography job for you while you're filming - I got a couple good stills of the bride and groom while the cameras were unmanned and shooting video with the SS function on...

I don't see the Canon as a "only cam", but if you are a shop that offers photo AND video with more than one shooter, this offers some interesting possibilities. Having the still shooter also picking up video gives you one more source of footage, and vice versa. Who couldn't appreciate another camera angle, especially a manned one?

All that said, I find it's pretty hard while under pressure to nail the video to pop off a still... your brain is already pretty well overloaded already, but the smile shutter capability offers an interesting insight into the next layer of technical evolution...

Some more lovely footage:

Click here (http://www.vimeo.com/2053280)

drool,
jones

Don't get me wrong i love the new 5D Mark III and will end-up buying a few for sure, but here are my three major problems with the present options, well maybe only two because i will use another source for my audio capture, but automatic exposure and the automatic focus.

With the present settings you cannot lock exposure and the auto focus is very choppy. Playing with the manual focus on the lens tens to make the whole unit shake and transfers very easily to your footage.

BUT here is half of these issues already addressed.

Photography: Redrock's Cinematizing Kit to Turn Video DSLRs Into Proper Movie Cams (http://gizmodo.com/5067638/redrocks-cinematizing-kit-to-turn-video-dslrs-into-proper-movie-cams)

What do you guys think?

BUT here is half of these issues already addressed.

Photography: Redrock's Cinematizing Kit to Turn Video DSLRs Into Proper Movie Cams (http://gizmodo.com/5067638/redrocks-cinematizing-kit-to-turn-video-dslrs-into-proper-movie-cams)

What do you guys think?

Interesting Idea, the cost must be going quiet high though with one of these rigs, I think for pre planned setup situations this setup would be awesome, but not realtime/doco shooting styles.

Keep in mind that most high-end photographers have exclusivity clauses in their contracts stating they can be the only professional photographer there. You could certainly run into problems bringing this along.

I also think that certain photographers with a good eye could put together a highlights clip that could compete with what many of us do and just use this cam. The footage this thing can produce doesn't even resemble what many of us deliver.

All things considered though, it isn't a huge cost savings to have an A1 + brevis + rails vs the 5d. The the A1 setup you get full manual control and 24P. The unit is larger but it also gives you more stability. I have shot handheld with the MK11 and while it works quite well, racking is very very tough. The cam, or at least the prototype I used, was auto ISO so it was good in low light but it was also very noisy and not something you could control.

P.

The unit is larger but it also gives you more stability. I have shot handheld with the MK11 and while it works quite well, racking is very very tough.
P.

Here's issue# 4 resolved. It's pretty interesting how fast new accessories are being introduce for this new workflow.

Zacuto Joins Pro Video Scene for Nikon D90 and Canon 5D Mark II Photography Bay | Digital Camera Reviews, News and Resources (http://www.photographybay.com/2008/10/29/zacuto-joins-pro-video-scene-for-nikon-d90-and-canon-5d-mark-ii/)

The Zacuto rig looks nice, but a bit sparse from the camera back. That's a lot of empty space. The second picture is way, way better than the first. Hellooooo Zacuto model.

The Redrock setup looks more compact, but it doesn't have a shoulder pad does it? Either way you go, these setups look a little ridiculous, but then again so do most of these same setups with the HV20/35mm Adapter thingies.

Back to the topic of photographers doing video with their cameras, I don't think you can do both jobs at the same time and do it well.

With all the buzz surrounding the 5D's video capability Canon would be nuts not to incorporate this into a proper video camera.

I haven't looked closely at the specs - what features make it work so much better in low light than their full sized counterparts?

jones

Good question Chris. I'm guessing here, but I'd say it has something to do with the larger sensor and whatever magic processing they employ that allows these cameras to shoot noise free stills at 2000+ ISO.

Maybe someone can come along with some fancy numbers and terminology to explain it better.

significantly larger sensor size, probably meaning the individual pixel sites are also larger meaning they can absorb more light, plus FAST GLASS makes a difference. I'm going to venture that those sweet night shots are with a 2.8 or better lens with a price well above $1K...

Noise reduction in software couldn't hurt either - if you can do it in post, no reason you can't do it in cam with enough processor horsepower and firmware.

Keep in mind that most high-end photographers have exclusivity clauses in their contracts stating they can be the only professional photographer there. You could certainly run into problems bringing this along.

I also think that certain photographers with a good eye could put together a highlights clip that could compete with what many of us do and just use this cam. The footage this thing can produce doesn't even resemble what many of us deliver.

All things considered though, it isn't a huge cost savings to have an A1 + brevis + rails vs the 5d. The the A1 setup you get full manual control and 24P. The unit is larger but it also gives you more stability. I have shot handheld with the MK11 and while it works quite well, racking is very very tough. The cam, or at least the prototype I used, was auto ISO so it was good in low light but it was also very noisy and not something you could control.

P.

Good points, Patrick. You're right about "certain" photographers putting together a highlights clip but I don't think a ton of them. As soon as they have to deal with the editing process I think they'll get turned off quickly. Now if they outsource the editing, that's another story - but I still think that this is most useful for videographers as long as there isn't the sticky wicket of the exclusivity clause that you mentioned. You're right about the footage too - it's absolutely stunning!

I should also mention the weird "pulsating" I was getting when I slowed the footage down but maybe that was just that I had it in the wrong sequence setting - who knows.

Anyone crazy enough to edit footage from someone who just shoots had better put a high price tag on it!!

IMO, the more you do post/edit, the better you are behind the camera! I learn more about shooting when I have to sit down and edit it into something good than any other way!

Your camera skill improves commensurate with how much of your own footage you have to "fix" <wink>.

From a photographers perspective I don't think you guys have anything to worry about, the studios that were going to get into video would do it with or without this camera.

I think most photographers that wish to venture into video will do it for the same reason that some videographers venture into photography and that would be marketing. If you are spending a certain percentage to attract a bride and groom that dollar value does not go up when you add additional features.

I think most of you are correct that most photographers are way too busy with their own editing and post processing, albums, etc, to ever seriously consider adding video editing to their daily task, not to mention most studios are also very busy doing high school seniors, family portraits, commercial jobs, executive portraits, all that bring in far greater revenue than the profit from a wedding video, although they may have no problem hiring a videographer to run that segment of the business.

I think I may have lost a few weddings over the years from couples that wanted a simple photography, videography package, I know many have asked me if we do both and were disappointed when I said no, even though I recommend two very good videographers.

I'm not unaware of how easy and valuable it would be for me to add video to my studio, but until I find that one videographer who is absolutely awesome, highly skilled with both camera and editing, is personable, loves weddings, keeps up on all the latest techniques, reads forums like this one constantly, and treats our customers like family and because I'm a terrible salesmen I would need their work to sell itself, until that point the concept of adding video will stay in the back of my mind.

The new Canon will allow me to add bits of video to my slide shows, but until I can find the perfect videographer I certainly do not need the headaches of adding video.

Competition may force my hand, videographers may start adding photography, or too many other photographers may adopt a one stop shop approach giving them a marketing advantage. Right now I'll concentrate on being the best photographer I can be, and trust to providence that should the time arrive when I have to add video, the right videographer will arrive as well.

Bill

Bill - I think you just posed your "videographer wanted" ad by mistake.

$5 says that the announcement will be some specs and a closeup 3D render that will leave you wondering what exactly you're looking at... is it a handle? or the camera?

Looks like I was right... sorta.


Ok, so it's not the actual announcement, but it is a closeup 3D render.

What I will use the 5D Mk II for is for a few highlight shots, not that my XHA1's don't do a good job, but I have over 10K in Canon fast glass that I use almost every day, that I can now use a limited time when doing video.

Many have commented on you need to do either video or photography, I agree somewhat doing both at the same time is very hard, but if your only adding straight edit ceremony to your photography, it can be done. And for the weeks you don't have a photography wedding, doesn't hurt to have a video wedding.

I love both, make more money on photography, but since adding video has helped bring in some extra income. I think the key is making sure your customer knows what you can do, luckily in my area its better than "Aunt Sue" can provide.

Looks like I was right... sorta.


Ok, so it's not the actual announcement, but it is a closeup 3D render.

That looks like the side of a DSLR directly to the right of the LCD. My guess...
BIll

I was foolin around with a d90 in the evening of my most recent wedding (after the photog left) and was pleasantly surprised at how natural people were while looking into the lens waiting for a photo to be taken.
Not realising of course that I was actually shooting video for the previous minute prior to taking the photo.
They can be very natural and also be fooling around in a way they never would if they knew.
I cut a sequence together showing the footage then the photo. Works well.