Ryan,
If you look further down this thread you will find still samples from Paul Cronin's tests with the tele. Completely unusable.

Again, this is anomoly. We have not experienced this with any other pieces that have left the factory. We have worked very hard to resolve Paul's issues with his camera.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

David thank you very much for getting me in gear to do this test. I have been very busy and had not taken the time to do a proper test with the Century 1.6 telephoto on the EX1.

Well the results are not good. The lens has the same problem I had with the wide angle and it is so bad I have asked for a RA# for the lens.

I did three test at full zoom with and with out the lens.

Stills:

Paul,

Was this in auto focus or manual focus? Any other camera settings would be useful to know.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

David thank you very much for getting me in gear to do this test. I have been very busy and had not taken the time to do a proper test with the Century 1.6 telephoto on the EX1.

Well the results are not good. The lens has the same problem I had with the wide angle and it is so bad I have asked for a RA# for the lens.

I did three test at full zoom with and with out the lens.

Stills:

A careful examination of the "without" photo's show a marked drop in sharpness off axis. They also show noticeable color fringing. Adding attachments (even very high quality ones like the Century 1.6x) magnifies the aberrations present in the camera's built in lens and add some of their own.

The Century 1.6X is very high quality ,originally designed by David Grafton (who won an Oscar this year for his design work). During the development of accessories for the Panasonic HVX200 the 1.6X design was reviewed by Optical Research Associates, quite possibly the premier independent optical design group in the world, who said the design could not be improved.

Most customers using Tele-Attachments are interested in the central part of the image, and the shallow depth of field mixes with any off axis issues to the extent that the customer is satisfied with the results. We have sold 1000's of the 1.6x with very few complaints.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

Ryan,
Any update on the vignetting issue with the .6x wide angle?

Ryan I tried both auto and manual. The pictures are with manual focus.

Ryan,
Any update on the vignetting issue with the .6x wide angle?

We have experienced this issue with less than 1% of the units shipped. It is an issue with the spacing of the lock ring and the individual camera.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

Most customers using Tele-Attachments are interested in the central part of the image, and the shallow depth of field mixes with any off axis issues to the extent that the customer is satisfied with the results. We have sold 1000's of the 1.6x with very few complaints.


Hi Ryan,

Thanks for your comments. I think that one of the main concerns would be the numerous instances where the subject may be centered (i.e. Paul's license plate example) where the goal is to have the subject filling more of the frame (thus the 1.6X). It just looks a bit odd to have the plates at one level of focus and the tail lights at another when they occupy the same depth of field.

Could you provide some of the samples that Century has produced in testing this lens that show performance at a near and far point of focus? It would be very helpful in seeing if I am realizing the norm for this lens' performance or an anomoly.

Thanks again.

We have experienced this issue with less than 1% of the units shipped. It is an issue with the spacing of the lock ring and the individual camera.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

Ryan,

I and a couple of others here are part of the 1%. Is there any way to fix my 0.6X lens - it vignettes very badly from about 6.5 - 12mm.

Is the only solution a return - and if I do will the new one also vignette?

Look forward to your reply.

The message is pretty clear Sutton. Buy Sony's pretty feeble 0.8x with its attached hood or abandon the idea completely. The Fujinon doesn't take kindly to add-ons, and the Bolex Aspheron (0.52x) that I've used for many years on other cameras is unuseable on the EX1.

Thanks Tom. That was exactly the kind of advice I was looking for! I have actually been impressed with some of the video I have seen others post while using the Sony 0.8x. I am just a little shocked that there isn't a better option yet.

cheers,
-sutton

Thanks Tom. That was exactly the kind of advice I was looking for! I have actually been impressed with some of the video I have seen others post while using the Sony 0.8x. I am just a little shocked that there isn't a better option yet.

cheers,
-sutton

I was asked by my local shop to check out and post some images of the new ZUNOW Optics 0.75 Wide Angle adaptor for the EX1. Its not schedule for international release till the fall but its out in Japan now. Ill be going into the shop thursday and will post screen shots hopefully that night. Apparently it has zero distortion and full zoom through but lets wait and see.

OK, I'm waiting to see. The Zunow produced for the Z1 was shown at the Video Forum in London last year but when fitted to my Z1 had oodles of barrel distortion. I didn't need to zoom to full tele to check it out further, I didn't want my brides barrelling in the middle.

Let's hope their latest design is better.

We have experienced this issue with less than 1% of the units shipped. It is an issue with the spacing of the lock ring and the individual camera.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

Well I guess I am part of the one percent also. I have vignetting from full wide, all the way through to above 10mm. The bulk of my shoots involve the need for a wide angle lens, so this is a problem. Is there a fix from those of us suffering from this issue? I know at one point you stated that you were "formulate a solution"....what are the options available for those of us with this issue? Is it something you are able to address or does the camera have to go back to Sony?

I got a chance to try out the new Zunow Wide Angle Lens here in Tokyo today. Who on earth are Zunow? Good question. They are a small Japanese Lens Maker who stiil hand make their lenses in Akita, Northern Japan. Its hard to get much information on them. They had a wide Angle for the Z1 that, although popular in Japan, seemed to get average reviews overseas.

I'm posting comparison shots with the Sony Wide Angle Adapter. I'm no pro user but here are my comments. Let me know if I left anything out. This Lens is nice piece.

My comments...
Noticeably less barrelling than the sony WA .
Its wider than the sony WA. Its 0.75. Sony's is 0.8.
It IS full zoom through just like the sony WA.
A removable hood unlike the sony WA permanently attached hood.
Heavier than the sony WA, around 830grams compared to the sony's 630grams.
It locks onto the front lens by putting it in position and turning a metal ring to lock position.
Very solid build. The hood is a hard rubber material.
It wont be available in the US until October.
It retails at 98,000 Yen here. That's about $900 US I think. I'm told it will be about 20% more when it hits the US market.
Seems like a better lens than the Sony WA but maybe hard to justify double the price for some people.

My local shop is trying to work something out for anyone wanting to buy one from outside Japan. If you are interested let me know. Otherwise you might try through your local dealer.

Cheers, Alex

Yes, the Zunow does barrel distort a lot less than the Sony, but to say it sees wider than the Sony is pushing at microns. Still, I find Sony's barrel distortion quite unacceptable, so even theough the Zunow is a huge amount of money, it's the one I'd choose from this comarison.

Shooting into the light would test out the flare, though as both lenses are hooded and multi-coated I'd not expect to see much difference between them.

tom.

yeah, I agree, fractionally wider but the less barrelling is really its strong point. That and the fact you can add a matt box. I panned around and did shoot some shots directly towards the sun actually. Maybe I'll post some stills if any one is interested.
I don't mind the barrelling on the sony. I don't film brides and the Japanese are all so skinny anyway.

Ryan,

I and a couple of others here are part of the 1%. Is there any way to fix my 0.6X lens - it vignettes very badly from about 6.5 - 12mm.

Is the only solution a return - and if I do will the new one also vignette?

Look forward to your reply.

Anyone experiencing issues with their lens can, as always, send thier lens in for inspection. However, we can only bring the lens to the specification we manufacture the lens to meet which is based on our testing of numerous Sony cameras. If the lens is found to be within our specifications and doesn't vignette on any of our samples of the EX1, then you may consider other avenues of inspection for your camera.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

Anyone experiencing issues with their lens can, as always, send thier lens in for inspection. However, we can only bring the lens to the specification we manufacture the lens to meet which is based on our testing of numerous Sony cameras. If the lens is found to be within our specifications and doesn't vignette on any of our samples of the EX1, then you may consider other avenues of inspection for your camera.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

Hi Ryan,

Thanks again for your responses here. I would respectfully ask again that you post some samples of these lenses working correctly. That will be a much more convenient manner for your customers to guage how their lens/camera combo is functioning, as opposed to a costly and time intensive send-back/inspection period. As you mentioned, these have been thoroughly tested, so it should be a fairly simple matter of posting already existing samples.

Is that not possible?

Randy

Anyone experiencing issues with their lens can, as always, send thier lens in for inspection. However, we can only bring the lens to the specification we manufacture the lens to meet which is based on our testing of numerous Sony cameras. If the lens is found to be within our specifications and doesn't vignette on any of our samples of the EX1, then you may consider other avenues of inspection for your camera.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

Ryan,
I have tried two .6x lens now and experienced similar vignetting on both. I am assuming then it is a camera issue. Can you please provide the information we should pass on to Sony to ensure they inspect and service the correct thing, since I only want to send it in once (if that!).

Thanks

From the samples posted the Sony is a lot sharper than the Zunow, both at full wide and zoomed-in.

FYI, barrel distortion is hard to avoid at this price point. It's something I can live with for the shooting I'm doing.

If I really need to reduce or remove it, that can be done with the help of a filter in After Effects. You do lose parts of the image, however.

From the samples posted the Sony is a lot sharper than the Zunow, both at full wide and zoomed-in.

FYI, barrel distortion is hard to avoid at this price point. It's something I can live with for the shooting I'm doing.

If I really need to reduce or remove it, that can be done with the help of a filter in After Effects. You do lose parts of the image, however.

Dean, Im not sure if I moved the focus ring when changing adapters. The Zunow was the second one. Although I had peaking on all shots, Im not sure if I had it at max on the zunow. Having said that though, while moving the zunow around and focusing I did find it hard to see any peaking fully zoomed in o another shot aimed more toward the sun. I thought that might have been because I had to close the aperture a little. I wish I'd had more time with it to confirm.

Alexander - - have you been using the Zunow lens? Still feeling good about it?
Can you please tell me how much farther out it extends from the EX's fixed lens?
I just spoke with someone at Schneider who said they're working on a replacement for their failed lens (they're hoping it'll come in at .7 rather than .75), but it'll be at least four months and more likely six months.
Cheers, Malcolm

I am with Malcolm and interested on updated info with the Zunow wide angle. Could really use one that works well.

Ryan,
I have tried two .6x lens now and experienced similar vignetting on both. I am assuming then it is a camera issue. Can you please provide the information we should pass on to Sony to ensure they inspect and service the correct thing, since I only want to send it in once (if that!).

Thanks

This is not an issue so much with Sony as direct fault. Rather it is a direct design issue with the Fujinon lens. This lens combined with the sensor size on the EX1 exhibits an unusually high level of barrel distortion and laterall of optical axis chormatic abberation. Fujinon has balanced this by creating some type of either spherical or aspheric element. Any accessory optic magnifies the flaws of the existing lens. Remember that even Sony didn't get it right with the first releases of this camera. The first ones did vignette as well. What is more interesting is that I did some tests with a Fujinon 18x ENG lens and the lens did vignette at full wide with a filter installed then went to no vignetting when zoomed in a couple millimeters. Then I zoomed it in a little more and it went back to vignetting. This shows that all optical designs are subject vignette even at some telephoto.

We have tested all of our lenses in stock and they do not vignette. The 1% number I gave was based on actual units recieved by us and proven to vignette. I trust all of our customers that when they say something vignettes that it does indeed do so. However, I cannot base numbers that I report off of speculation unless I see it for sure. Again, if you have an issue with the lens you are welcome to send it back for inspection.

The best solution in any case (Schneider Century accessories lenses or other brand) is to zoom in a little bit. This will increase the optical performance all around. Anytime you use the full margins of a lens at full wide, you will experience worse image quality. This is true of the Fujinon lens in the EX1 and all other lenses out there. Manufacturers design lenses to the limits of what they are capable to do for the money that you will pay. Schneider manufacturs a lens for still photography that is the sharpest lens available for purchase. We make this lens but the cost is very high. Fujinon is very capable of making sharper lenses that perform at much higher levels. In fact they do make such lenses but the cost is prohibitive to most of us out there, myself included. The simple fact is what can they design for what you will pay. Any accessory optic will magnify any design flaws in the lens. Schneider Century attachments are engineered at the highest quality and tolerances we can make them with the same limitations manufacturers have.

We are committed to our customers and their demanding needs. Please consider these recommendations and realize that you will still obtain the widest image with Century attachments at the best quality. If you choose to zoom in a little bit, you will gain much better results no matter how good our optical design is.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

This is not an issue so much with Sony as direct fault. Rather it is a direct design issue with the Fujinon lens. This lens combined with the sensor size on the EX1 exhibits an unusually high level of barrel distortion and laterall of optical axis chormatic abberation. Fujinon has balanced this by creating some type of either spherical or aspheric element. Any accessory optic magnifies the flaws of the existing lens. Remember that even Sony didn't get it right with the first releases of this camera. The first ones did vignette as well. What is more interesting is that I did some tests with a Fujinon 18x ENG lens and the lens did vignette at full wide with a filter installed then went to no vignetting when zoomed in a couple millimeters. Then I zoomed it in a little more and it went back to vignetting. This shows that all optical designs are subject vignette even at some telephoto.

We have tested all of our lenses in stock and they do not vignette. The 1% number I gave was based on actual units recieved by us and proven to vignette. I trust all of our customers that when they say something vignettes that it does indeed do so. However, I cannot base numbers that I report off of speculation unless I see it for sure. Again, if you have an issue with the lens you are welcome to send it back for inspection.

The best solution in any case (Schneider Century accessories lenses or other brand) is to zoom in a little bit. This will increase the optical performance all around. Anytime you use the full margins of a lens at full wide, you will experience worse image quality. This is true of the Fujinon lens in the EX1 and all other lenses out there. Manufacturers design lenses to the limits of what they are capable to do for the money that you will pay. Schneider manufacturs a lens for still photography that is the sharpest lens available for purchase. We make this lens but the cost is very high. Fujinon is very capable of making sharper lenses that perform at much higher levels. In fact they do make such lenses but the cost is prohibitive to most of us out there, myself included. The simple fact is what can they design for what you will pay. Any accessory optic will magnify any design flaws in the lens. Schneider Century attachments are engineered at the highest quality and tolerances we can make them with the same limitations manufacturers have.

We are committed to our customers and their demanding needs. Please consider these recommendations and realize that you will still obtain the widest image with Century attachments at the best quality. If you choose to zoom in a little bit, you will gain much better results no matter how good our optical design is.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

any news on the fisheye and it's projected shipping date?

tia!

This is not an issue so much with Sony as direct fault. Rather it is a direct design issue with the Fujinon lens. This lens combined with the sensor size on the EX1 exhibits an unusually high level of barrel distortion and laterall of optical axis chormatic abberation. Fujinon has balanced this by creating some type of either spherical or aspheric element. Any accessory optic magnifies the flaws of the existing lens. Remember that even Sony didn't get it right with the first releases of this camera. The first ones did vignette as well. What is more interesting is that I did some tests with a Fujinon 18x ENG lens and the lens did vignette at full wide with a filter installed then went to no vignetting when zoomed in a couple millimeters. Then I zoomed it in a little more and it went back to vignetting. This shows that all optical designs are subject vignette even at some telephoto.

We have tested all of our lenses in stock and they do not vignette. The 1% number I gave was based on actual units recieved by us and proven to vignette. I trust all of our customers that when they say something vignettes that it does indeed do so. However, I cannot base numbers that I report off of speculation unless I see it for sure. Again, if you have an issue with the lens you are welcome to send it back for inspection.

The best solution in any case (Schneider Century accessories lenses or other brand) is to zoom in a little bit. This will increase the optical performance all around. Anytime you use the full margins of a lens at full wide, you will experience worse image quality. This is true of the Fujinon lens in the EX1 and all other lenses out there. Manufacturers design lenses to the limits of what they are capable to do for the money that you will pay. Schneider manufacturs a lens for still photography that is the sharpest lens available for purchase. We make this lens but the cost is very high. Fujinon is very capable of making sharper lenses that perform at much higher levels. In fact they do make such lenses but the cost is prohibitive to most of us out there, myself included. The simple fact is what can they design for what you will pay. Any accessory optic will magnify any design flaws in the lens. Schneider Century attachments are engineered at the highest quality and tolerances we can make them with the same limitations manufacturers have.

We are committed to our customers and their demanding needs. Please consider these recommendations and realize that you will still obtain the widest image with Century attachments at the best quality. If you choose to zoom in a little bit, you will gain much better results no matter how good our optical design is.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

Ryan,

THe problem we have with the 0.6X is that it doesn't vignette too much at full wide, but if you zoom in even a whisker it vignettes badly - so we can't zoom in a bit - which is exactly what I like to do.

Hey guys - Don and Graeme - do you really need to lengthen the thread and soak the bandwidth by including *all* of Ryan's post for your two line replies? Just a thought.

I am also with Don on interest in the Fisheye release?

Fair comment Tom - if I could have just included the little bit of the quote that was relevant I would have.

relevant

Hi Graeme, Just click Quote, then edit what you don't want out of the quote (select/delete).
Cheers, Malcolm

Hey guys - Don and Graeme - do you really need to lengthen the thread and soak the bandwidth by including *all* of Ryan's post for your two line replies? Just a thought.

I agree with Tom. Maybe I shouldn't be so long winded to avoid the problem altogether but I know that isn't going to happen. :)

Also, to all interested, I have discovered that our .6x attachment does vignette slightly when the camera's image stabilization system is turned on. We do all testing with this off while attached to a tripod and it took testing the camera outside to discover the problem by chance. So avoid image stabilization or zoom in a couple millimeters when it is turned on.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics

any news on the fisheye and it's projected shipping date?

tia!

This week or next. Your delivery time will vary on when you ordered it and/or which dealer you order from that jumped in line early. I would suspect that we will be able to ship all units on back order.

Ryan Avery
Schneider Optics