I've finally completed a 22-minute nature documentary about a nature reserve in Trinidad. It was made using the Panasonic AG-DVC30 and I used Mercalli stabilising software quite a bit (although the original footage isn't all that shaky) because I was looking for a smooth presentation. The clip I'm trying to upload is 1 minute 18 seconds, taken from the beginning of the main narrative. There are both MPEG and WMV versions and none of them will upload as an attachment. They're both well within the MB size and dimensions, but they won't upload, the progress bar is stuck at the full thing but the files won't come in. What to do??

Sounds interesting!

have you met the resolution requirement

47.68 MB 320 320

24.80 MB 640 480

?

Yes I have, Mat. In both, the screen is 320 x 240. Will try again later.

You could post it on Vimeo or another sharing site or if you have a website, put it on a page and link it. I have never been able to upload any size so i just use links, cuts down on the hassle

Thanks for the suggestion Hugh. Here's the link Mat and Hugh:

http://www.vimeo.com/903809

I noticed Vimeo enlarged it from 320 x 240 so it's a little fuzzy. I'd like to hear some critique about it, but I wonder if it's too short in length for a proper critique. Well, I'll wait to hear the comments. Please put the comments here in the thread as opposed to the Vimeo page, thanks.

:-)

I found the effects of compression distracting, so it's difficult to give a critique. I loaded up a clip in full frame mpeg and let Vimeo do the compression, and got better quality - it is worth trying.

Hi Helen

I think this section of your film shows good shot variation giving a real 360 view of the subject. The shots on the ground are of a higher quality although the compression isn't great and may help the arial stuff somewhat. What I wasn't keen on was the writing. I found it a bit obvious/simple and repetitive at the end. The narration needed a bit more 'character' to it although the chaps voice seems fine.

It would be interesting to see some more!

Cheers
Mat

Annie, I will re-do the upload and come back and post when it's up.

Mat, I'm thinking that you mean the script needs to have more information in it, beyond the facts. What kind of info would you include if you were making a script for a nature/wildlife doc?

The aerial clips were taken through the front window of the aircraft as the pilot wouldn't allow us to open the side window and put the camera through. So the colour and clarity dropped a little. I tried to put back a little using the Video Effects in Premiere Elements.

Helen, I miss the music, does it run 22minutes without any..? Cheers.

Helen - As far as what to include I can only say whatever is necessary to move the story along. Let the pictures speak for you whenever they can, don't narrate what you can see in the image, add what you can't see...interesting facts, back story etc. - 'The atlantic coast is scenic with beaches and coconut trees' for instance...I can see all of that information so the voiceover is spoon feeding.

The bit about salt water/fresh water from 1min onward just sounded repetitive and and to be honest didn't say much. 'Wetlands are swamps' for instance... I kind of get what you were trying to say with it being a fresh water/tidal wetland but it seemed confused.

Hope this explains my thoughts a bit better. Look forward to seeing some more and hearing more about your film!

Helen, I miss the music, does it run 22minutes without any..? Cheers.

I don't really, but I know what Allan means. The pace is possibly a little slow to do without any music on that opening section partly due to the commentary, but please don't fill it up with just any old rubbish that's free/cheap. Something with local character might be a good idea - a folk song perhaps or local group (I can't see it working with a steel band in carnival mood).

As a musician, I find many films are spoiled by inappropriate music which distracts from the message of the visuals. It's interesting seeing a clip without the music. I often have to mute the sound to appreciate the video fully.

I enjoyed the extract - thanks for posting.

Mat, I understand what you mean about saying the same thing you're seeing. As the video goes along, things are explained which aren't visible, such as how much rain falls, when the peak ranfall season is, that a particular palm tree species is used locally to make baskets and twine (string) and so on. Then, there is wildlife with howler monkeys, macaws and other birds and the narration is information about them. Other wildlife too comes into the picture.

Colin, the pace is the same throughout actually. I was trying not to show images too rapidly, let them flow to show the audience what the area looks like and let them take it in. And then, just provide something informative as they are seeing the images.

Allan and Colin, I have music in part of the introduction (the part that appears before this one). The opening minute has only natural sounds recorded from the area plus an introductory narrative, then for 38 seconds I have a musical intro with quick images of the scenery and some wildlife (there is no narration here), the musical intro is to lead to the title of the video. Then, there is music and narration in the conclusion (I'll put up a clip later today).

I'd have liked to have some more music throughout but I was looking at a combination of budget and wanting to present the area with nature sounds. What do you think about 15 minutes of nature sounds, water and bird sounds, without music?

Helen, I have to agree with Mat regarding your writing. Your narration is just telling me what I see, which is unnecessary since I can see it. You aren't telling a story, explaining the interaction of the swamp with it's wildlife, or how the people who live near the swamp impact it, use it or protect it.

What you've basically said is here's a beach and some trees and some water. Is that it? Where's the food web, flora and fauna? Is there a threat or is this a pristine area protected from pollution and global warming. What's your point???

Was replacing the video with a portion from the centre of the narrative, but the Internet connection is slooow. May try another time. Thanks though for the constructive comments.

But Helen, we don't know your intended destination/audience for your show. That's important and spells out how you should approach production. For example, if it's for the Nat. Geo channel then you need an opening that'll grab your audience and you've got less than 60secs to do it. You need music and fx there for sure.

If it's for a church group then you can lay back a bit, but you still need music basically to help keep continuity and entertainment.

David Attenborough might swing it but IMO 15mins without music in your 22min show won't work. Use it to start new sequences, doesn't have to be long pieces, use it for effect.

Slip over to the Trinidad Music Society and get some solo instrumentalists, bassoon for the crabs, guitar for seals and harp for the bird sequences. Let 'em record to pix and give them a credit, they'll love it.

What I'd always suggest is, if you can, watch some similar TV progs to get ideas. Even record some and for the pictures, watch with the sound off. For the sound, turn the pix off. Hope this helps you in some way.

Cheers.

This is a very nice suggestion Allan. I am going to include some music as you suggested and thanks for even detailing how to approach it.

My intention is to sell the program to the TV station(s). As for a particular audience, I'm trying to appeal to a certain disposition rather than an age group - an audience who's interested in something educational. But I get what Mat was saying about the script being a little too simple. I'm working on adding in more.

(Still trying to upload another clip but at 9 kb per second upload speed it's going to take 26 hours....and they call this broadband! ha ha!)

What do you think about 15 minutes of nature sounds, water and bird sounds, without music?

Some would dismiss this out of hand - I say go for it and see if it works. If your images and sounds are interesting enough it could reinforce the atmosphere and view like a more traditional BBC style doc. But I'd really like to see it.

I have to agree with Allan. When somethings got a very regional flavour like this...local music could really make things fly! Go easy though, I think its brave to go without it but a little will really add some flavour. Best thing is to go and study something you aspire to and see how they've used the music to effect the flow and mood. One that springs to mind is the Andes to Amazon series!

Even better would have been Flight of the Condor (again a BBC three-parter, but just about the Andes) but unless you happened to see it when it was aired twenty-odd years ago . . . . . . and maybe my memory of it isn't brilliant, but there didn't seem to be a lot of music in it, or else the music just wasn't intrusive enough to be noticeable.

Colin, I'm trying to upload a piece taken on two of the river channels, it's a minute and some seconds long. Will put the link up when it uploads.

Mat and Annie, I will try to get a hold of those documentaries.

Tried to look at vimeo clip but it says its not there!, when you upload to vimeo the clip should be approx the size of Vimeo, somewhere 550x400 or in that range, definitely an mpeg 4 at 1 mbps, I use 3mbps, although the clips start getting large. but vimeo is closer to hd than most so the bit rate has to higher. You might have to experiment a little, put a short one up at different bit rates to see what it looks like.

My connection is super slow, when I get can get it uploaded I'll come back and post. Hugh, I was in the process of replacing the clip so it isn't there.

Here's a clip on the river channels with just natural sounds. I hope the sounds come across clearly, but I think I have to raise the volume. I was too conservative with the volume of the bird sounds thinking they would compete with the narrator, but I was looking at "Getaway" on Discovery Travel & Adventure and while the host was talking, there was this screaming cicada (or another insect) and I was surprised at how loud it was yet it didn't collide with listening to the host. I had toned down the cicada that I'd recorded while in the forested area but it's now too soft.

(I already know what the comments about the narrative will be, this clip is for an analysis of the imagery combined with the nature sounds.)

http://www.vimeo.com/914593

(If you can't see the video just yet, Vimeo is still converting, but it's been uploaded.)

Here's a clip on the river channels with just natural sounds...

(I already know what the comments about the narrative will be, this clip is for an analysis of the imagery combined with the nature sounds.)

http://www.vimeo.com/914593


Apart from the shots at the Nariva swamp notice, I'm hearing more engine and water sounds than anything else - not what I would call wildlife :-). Basically that is the equivalent of your room tone, and is in effect, silence.
Out of 1' 17" in the clip there's only the 18" at the Nariva swamp notice which has the kind of interesting and atmospheric sounds needed to carry it. I think you may have to use some more music.

Also, while it might be appropriate in places just to cut the video without transitions, it might help to crossfade the audio a bit to avoid a "bump" effect unless you want to emphasise a sudden change.

Hope that didn't sound negative - it's a great bit of work.

Helen - have you noticed that if you are driving along, it can be hard to hear someone's voice above the noise of the engine, but a birdsong will come across quite clearly? The birdsong is at a completely different pitch range to the human voice and car engine, so it doesn't compete. But if you have lots of birds singing at the same time, it can be hard to pick out one individual from the crowd.

The same applies to a soundtrack. The natural sounds often do not compete with the narrater's voice, so you don't need to reduce the volume.

The boat engine noise is somewhat annoying because it changes volume between clips. You really need to find a section of video where the boat engine isn't running and you have plenty of natural sounds - preferably 30 seconds or more. Then kill the sound in the individual clips and just run the continuous "wild" sound as one layer of your soundtrack.

A fairly good rule is "listen to the original sound in the clips - then replace it"

Good, thanks for both coments!

Here's a short demo of the program. Added in narration and music. I've been trying to shop it around to get it on television here, however, sponsors are difficult to come by.

I'm looking forward to learning more, this is just the beginning, as time and experience goes on, it'll get better, but I'm satisfied with the effort. And I still welcome your comments and suggestions.

:-)

http://www.vimeo.com/1366934

Hi Helen,
Lovely footage, easy to understand narration. Having been to Trindad, I think I might be correct in suggesting that a large number of tourists who come there are birders. I would have put more birds in the mix. Pearl Kite, Parrotlets, Trogons, and some of the many species of Antbirds, Woodpeckers, etc. would make this video much more inticing to that group of tourists. Everyone has seen a Blue and Gold Macaw, if only in a zoo or pet shop, and Black-bellied Whistling Ducks are common in many places. Put in some of those hidden swamp gems, likw Common Potoo and watch the birders salivate.

Helen, it is looking better each time I see it. Great job. Bob Safay

Thanks Steve. Great observation about birding! My equipment and budget only allowed for seeing some of the bird species, but it's a great angle to present for another project - however, I do have the Purple Gallinule if that counts as uncommon. :-)

Thanks Bob!

Hi Helen,

Have to agree with Bob, getting better all the time. I saw a Purple Gallinule when we visited the Dominican Republic a few years back , a beautiful bird. As Trinidad and Tobago are worldwide known birding hot spots Steve's idea maybe worth taking on board for future projects.

Regards

Mick

Mick, thank you. A program on the bird species found at the wetlands would be an entire program in itself. It's a good idea.