Anyone shooting weddings with DOF adapters? They seem a little cumbersome but the footage looks amazing.
I just ordered the DIY M2 Guide from redrock. hopefully it will go together ok.

Anyone shooting weddings with DOF adapters? They seem a little cumbersome but the footage looks amazing.
I just ordered the DIY M2 Guide from redrock. hopefully it will go together ok.

Truly cumbersome. But truly awesome images.

I use them from time to time so does Still Motion. Ian Lim too for his engagement/save the date sessions.

I just ordered one today for use on a bridal shoot in mid May. I'll have to play with it some to see if I think I can use it on a wedding day, but I think it should be just about perfect for a bridal shoot. We'll see. I'm a little nervous about he learning curve, but after seeing Ian Lim's latest wedding trailer I had to get one and try.
Why do I still get so excited about buying this kinda stuff?

Because we're all techno geeks Ethan =)


What did you get and for which camera?

Learning curve is low. You know what you have to do, it's just telling your hand to turn at precise increments which is a killer.

good luck.

I got a Letus Extreme and rails for use with a variety of cameras for a variety of applications, but for the shoot in May I'll be using it with a HV20 since I prefer to use my FX7 on the stedicam. I'm not worried about light sensitivity with the HV20/Letus combo since I'll be outside with it most of the time anyway for this shoot. I figure that during a wedding the Letus setup will be used for exteriors, and any outside bride and groom stuff we're lucky enough to get the day of. I don't imagine I'll get much out of that setup indoors since you have the double whammy of light loss through the adaptor and poor low light performance of the HV20. We'll see.

If I fall in love with the adaptor, I'll keep it around for future gear upgrades which hopefully will include some new camera gear that is better in low light. I'm actually kinda hoping Sony or Canon surprises us at NAB with a decent low light and affordable (under $3500) camera. If something like that comes along I can see a world where I'm using the adaptor a great deal. Until then it'll have to be a specialty device for when the right situation presents itself.

Of course all this is said as someone who hasn't tried the gear out yet. It's just what I'm thinking going in.

you mentioned for a variety of cameras. I don't have the extreme yet but isn't one model specifically for use with just one camera (or at least with the same diameter).

correct me if i'm wrong but it wasn't the mini you ordered? how are you hooking it up to the HV.

Thanks. Need to ask cause I'm on the verge of getting a mini.

Jason,
I decided against the Mini because it's only designed to work with the smaller HV20 sized cameras. Only the LEX was designed to be used with both the larger and smaller cameras. I also plan on upgrading my gear in the coming year or two depending on what is released and would prefer to have an adaptor that was scalable upward.
The only place I see an advantage for the Mini is that when paired with the smaller cameras and a lightweight lens you can probably get away with going handheld.

As far as I understand it, all you need to make the LEX work with cameras of different sizes are the proper step-up (or is it stepdown) rings. I think. Maybe.
**EDIT**
I see on the Letus site that they sell special kits for the HVX200 and EX1 but these appear to consist of a step-up ring and replacement achromat that attach to the LEX. I'm contacting Letus tomorrow to see if I need to order anything specific to pair it to my cameras. I don't see this being a problem.

If you know you only want to use it with your HV20, then the Mini is probably the better choice for you.

Thanks Ethan,

Please let us know waht Letus tells you. Getting the mini is very limiting. And It's almost as expensive.

Sometimes limiting isn't such a bad thing. How does the old saying go? Jack of all trades, master of none.

It appears to me that the LEX has a native thread size of 72mm and that you can buy step-up rings directly from Letus that take it to 77mm or 82mm.
I'm assuming to make it fit my smaller cameras that I'd do the opposite and buy step-down rings to fit my camera's threads. I guess.

Way to go, Ethan! :D

Thanks Ian, it's all cause of you big guy. At least that's what I'll say when it all goes terribly wrong and my wife is steaming mad. You ever had 100lbs of angry Cajun woman attack you before? It's not pretty.

And Jason I'm probably wont hear back form the guys at Letus till tomorrow, but it does appear that you just need the proper step-down rings to fit whatever camera you are using. For the HV20 it takes 3 rings.... unless you wander over to Cinevate's site and order their 2 piece 43-72mm ring (http://www.cinevate.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=52). Gotta love message boards and web searches. I'd never find this stuff otherwise.

I hope I don't regret ordering all this stuff before NAB.

Like Jason mentioned, we use adapters quite a bit. In fact, most weddings have two for use throughout the day. They certainly are cumbersome but that factor goes way down as you get used to them. We use the brevis with flip/rails/follow focus and it is a very solid setup that is good handheld or tripod mounted. The footage is certainly worth the hassle.

We have two recent clips on our blog that have quite a bit of brevis footage:
1. a La Vegas photographer shoot out that is about a week old
2. a trailer I am posting now from a wedding we shot in Cali this weekend

Why is it that nobody seems to have heard of Brevis? It is in the same range, has excellent optics, very low light loss, and is very solid.

Patrick

I think if you are able to manage the adapters it is a solid advantage over your competitors given that such things are not very common right now. As people mentioned, the image you get from them are a league of their own and can only make your work stand out from your competitors. That is, if you use them properly like the Ian and Patrick and all the other great work we've seen done with them.

The question I still haven't answered is whether the client notices a difference when we use the adapter. I have been using these for about a year and I'm still not sure how many couples really notice- but it does make a substantially better product in my eyes, so that is why we stick with them. The full body-mounted steadicam makes big difference to our production and clients always mention loving that footage right away.

Patrick

Well now you've opened up a big philosophical question that runs through my mind all the time. At what point does the client no longer notice the extra effort given be it using a complex system like a Brevis or Letus or hours of extra color correction and audio clean up. In my mind I've come to the conclusion that a lot of what we do is subconscious to the general public who is viewing our work. They may not know or understand why a stedicam's motion draws them into a piece, appreciate the subtlety of selective focus, or comprehend the use of color to convey mood but they do understand that what you're doing is different and the work speaks to them on a deeper level because of all the effort. I do think that certain clients of mine get it and those are the ones I get excited about.

but it does make a substantially better product in my eyes
And you have a pretty darn good eye. I'd keep trusting that if I were you.

On a different topic I looked at the Brevis long and hard, but decided against it because it's even more cumbersome than the LEX once you add the flip module and all that. Ideally I would have selected the Letus Mini for it's size and weight in the hopes of foregoing rails all together since I much prefer to work handheld but for the reasons I stated before I went with the LEX.
When you're working with your Brevis handheld, are you just holding the unit by the rails or do you have some other type of device to aide in this?

Hi Ethan,

Did you get a reply from Letus on the compatibility of the Extreme with the HV20? I've been looking at a Letus Mini to twin up with my HV20 but.....if what you are saying turns out to be true, then having the option to use the Extreme with both my XH-A1's or the HV20 would be great, and well worth the extra dollars for the extreme.

At the moment, I'm just "playing" with a DIY static adapter on my HV20. It's a total mind melt to use as, if you move left it goes right, if you move up it goes down, seeing as their is no flip to it. Then you throw in the tiny HV20 screen for focusing and you can REALLY have some fun!

You can modify your HV20 to get the correct flip and reverse but it involves stripping it to pieces. Need some brave pills first.

What I do like is, that it is really compact and easy to have slung over your shoulder, ready to grab at anytime. Because of the mind melt stuff above, hand held takes awhile to get used to, but I'm getting there.


WIth a bit of practice I'm starting to get more useable shots from it.

I'm not even pretending to be in the same league as the big guys. That said, it definetely does give a different feel to the video. I think we had every possible combination of weather on this day. Rain, hail, sleet, snow. You guys in the sun don't know how lucky you are!

You can also see how the HV20 struggles with low light on some of the indoor shots.

http://www.vimeo.com/866175

From what I can tell by reading on various message boards, the HV20 will work with the LEX, but it's not ideal and that's why Letus designed the Mini. Seems that you have to zoom into the ground glass a bit more than you want to with the HV20 thereby increasing your lowest f-stop from 1.8 to 2.6 and also increasing the effective mm rating of the lens.
Please understand that this is what I gather from reading on message boards and is not pulled from personal experience. I'll let you know in about 2 weeks what my findings are after I've gotten everything in the mail and had a little time to test.

Oh and for full disclosure here, I'll let you all know that the reason I went with the LEX when I did was that I got it and the rails second hand for a great price. I couldn't pass that up.

**EDIT**
Alastair,
Now come on man, that didn't look half as bad as you let on. I like the fact that you didn't do a shift focus every 5 seconds. I figure I'll way over use that early on.
What lenses are you using? I'm still trying to figure out what I want to buy mm wise. I have a 50mm coming and figure I'll learn on that, but what other ones do you have?
I'll gladly shoot in the sleet if I can do a castle wedding with owls, falcons, and dudes in kilts. My wife would kill for that.

Nikon 50mm 1.4 is what I am using. This also seems to be the weapon of choice for just about everybody as far as I can see. My wife has some other Nikon lenses. I haven't been brave enough to try hanging anything else onto the adpater yet. Having too much fun with the 50mm, and, there is the worry about putting any extra weight on the threads, as I'm not using any support rods.

It seems one advantage for using the Letus Mini with the HV20 instead of the LEX is that it's much lighter so you don't need to have rails support, making it truly more "run and gun." The LEX is more adaptable with a wider range of cameras but may be overkill for such a small camera like the HV20.

Alastair, it can definitely get frustrating trying to frame your footage with the footage upside down! I've done the flip hack on my HV20 and am now waiting for parts for my adapter ;)

I have a 28mm and a 50mm but I think I'll want longer lenses as it suits my shooting style better. I like staying in the background and getting closeups!

I ordered the Letus Mini for my HV30.

I also ordered a rail system because I'm a bit suspect of the rigidity of the whole setup without the rails. I also believe that it's recommended to have rails if you want to store the whole setup in a case assembled. The LEX would be a smarter choice for its flexibility and resale value but I think we should all buy for whatever we're going to use for the present time. I'm still using my DVX100 along with the HV30 and I really don't want to run n' gun with a 10lb DVX100+LEX+Rails+lens...

Now I need to buy a Canon 50mm 1.2 or 1.4..

I don't hear or read good things about the 50mm f1.2. Supposedly it's a little soft.
I got my LEX and rails in yesterday afternoon, forced open a Nikon Digital zoom (17-70 f-slow.slower) and slapped it on the adaptor just to get an idea of what it'll be like. My first impression is that it's heavier than I'd imagined. I know the weights are listed online, but once you get it in your hands you realize just how heavy it is. It seems solidly built and appears to be a fairly simple design which = fewer things to break.
I'll let you guys know about the setup when my stepup rings and 50mm lens arrive next week. I'll set it up with my FX7 and HV20 and report on the differences.

I don't hear or read good things about the 50mm f1.2. Supposedly it's a little soft.

It's probably not so much that it's soft but that the DoF is so shallow that it's hard to get tack sharp focus. For most situations, you'd probably want to stop down the lens so that your focus will be better.

Any lens at the top or bottom of its fstop range will be soft. I know that the 1.2 50mm is supposed to be softer then the 1.4. For that reason I purchased the 1.4.

I haven't used my Brevis at a wedding yet, most of the time I'm on the glide cam and it's hard to switch the set up off and on. If only I had an extra camera! I do love my Brevis it's been great for shooting shorts and features.

Here's what Letus say re using an extreme with an HV20.

"You can use a step ring no problem. I use a set of two on my HV20 / Extreme. They are listed in this article:

http://support.letusdirect.com/?linkact=kb&i=15&c=C1

Light loss when using a step ring would be negligible if any. You are only adding a few millimeters of extra distance between the adapter and the camera."

This weekend FedEx "delivered" my 50mm lens. Problem was, my wife and I were out of town shooting a wedding and when I get home, there was no package at the door. Sucks.

Yesterday I got my stepup rings in so I grabbed my wife's D70, popped off the lens, locked open the aperture (using a modified pen top) slapped it on my rig and went out into the back yard to do the "hey, I just got an adapter and will now shoot all the flowers around my house" bit.

Now I have to admit to all of you that I'm very very very tempted to make up a story about how I hated the adapter and that it wont ever work for weddings, blah blah blah. This would be to protect the secret weapon I now have at my disposal and the look associated with it, but I wont do that. I'll be nice and share.

I LOVE this thing, even with the crappy digital zoom lens on it that everyone says not to use. In 5 minutes of shooting in my yard, not knowing what the hell I was doing at god knows what f-stop and completely winging the whole deal I was able to get some beautiful shots.

Guys, get this, let it sink in, especially you younger fellas who don't know what video use to cost. I'm using a $800 HV20, a $270 Digital zoom lens, and a few vibrating pieces of glass and prism that cost me $1,200 and I'm getting shots that you couldn't have pulled out of a $50,000 camera 4 years ago. It's simply stunning.

I must say, to my surprise I really really enjoyed shooting using a zoom lens. I know everyone is all over the primes I'm sure for speed and sharpness indoors, but outside, I don't see a reason not to go with a slow zoom. It's not like you don't have the light. It frees you up a lot as far as your framing options. I might just stick with that lens when I'm outside. It's a 18-70mm f3.5-4.5 Nikon DX lens that came standard with the D70 if you want to know. I don't know a darn about optics, but I do know a good shot when I see one and I like what I saw yesterday. Anyone know why they say not to use these digital lenses?

One thing I know is wrong with my footage is that I'm not zoomed in enough to avoid some vignetting on the left of the frame. Anyone know if you can adjust the HV20 or the LEX so that you're more centered on the focusing screen or do you simply have to zoom in farther? I'm already pretty darn close to full zoom as it is. Is there a little trick I don't know yet? I'm working on posting my afternoon shoot if anyone is curious. It's the same ol fare as anyone who just got one of these new toys, flowers and shift focus out the wazzu, but I think it's pretty.

Hey Ethan, congrats on your LEX adapter! I'm jealous :)

Looking forward to see your footages with LEX. I'm considering to buy Letus Mini or Extreme also. Yay!

Hey Ethan, congrats on your LEX adapter! I'm jealous :)

Ian, trust me, you have nothing to be jealous about. It was seeing your stuff that made me go out and buy this thing. I'm not sure you need a LEX, your homebrew adapter footage looks great.

Looking forward to see your footages with LEX. I'm considering to buy Letus Mini or Extreme also. Yay!

I have a very rough, repeat, very rough clip up on Vimeo. I slapped the adaptor together and ran out back to shoot anything and everything. I don't stop playing with the focus for longer than 3 seconds. If you really want to put yourself through it, you can have a look. (http://www.vimeo.com/901632)

Very nice footage, Ethan!

I'm considering LEX or Mini maybe because I cant stand the flipped images for the run n gun shooting.

I just got a Vivitar lens (Nikon mount) 28-105mm f.2.8-3.8 and wondering if this is going to be vignetting when using the Letus.

Is your setup perfect for run n gun shooting? Is it less bulky? Any pics of your setup will be much appreciated! :)

From my very limited experience thus far with my setup, I'd say that as long as you zoom in on the gg far enough vignetting shouldn't be a problem. You'll lose some of your FOV this way, but if vignetting concerns you then that is how you'll overcome it. I happen to like a bit of vignetting so I've been tending to keep my zoom pretty close to the edges of the frame on the gg.

As far as run and gun shooting is concerned, I don't see why it's not possible with the LEX, rails and HV20 setup I have going right now. I've tried it off the rails a few times but I keep going back to the rails because the whole thing just feels more solid on them. I could be crazy, but it seems to me that I actually control the camera better when it's on the rails than when it's not. If you're running and gunning outdoors I still think a zoom will beat the crap out of a prime any day of the week due to the flexibility if affords.

The one problem I'm seeing right now is removing the battery from the HV20 is difficult due to where it sits on the plate. As it stands right now I'd have to take my rig partially apart to be able to access the underside of the camera to put on a fresh battery and this isn't something I want to be doing too much in the field. I'll see what I can come up with.

My Nikon 50mm lens mysteriously appeared today and I noticed right off the bat that you don't have to zoom into the gg nearly as far with it as I did the DX lens. Maybe this is one of the reasons people are against the DX lenses? I'm not really sure. I do think that I'll keep using that DX lens outdoors.

Inside, I'm not so sure the HV20 and 1.8 lens will cut it. If you're in a room with plenty of available sunlight you might be fine, but under 100 watt bulbs I'm having to punch in some gain. I've yet to mount my FX7 to the Letus to test it indoors. I'd imagine it's better inside but I won't know for sure till I give it a shot.

Hi Ethan,

Glad to hear you are enjoying the dof experience.

Any chance you can post a pic of your HV20 Lex and rail setup?

You can see it here (http://www.dvinfo.net/gallery/browseimages.php?do=member&imageuser=7051)

Thanks Ethan thats hugely helpful. Wow..the extreme is a pretty big beast.

I'm jealous of the extreme but......not of the rails. Makes it look fairly hefty to lug about.

I can't help but think somebody should make up a formed/fitted support for the HV20/Letus combo, that keeps it as compact as possible. Thats a big appeal abotut this setup for me.

Doe the Letus have a 1/4 x 20 hole for mounting it (can't see from the pics)

Thanks again for taking the time to post those.

Hi Ethan,

This would solve your battery issue.

http://www.jetsetmodels.info/pics/hv20_support.jpg

Ethan, the reason the DX lens vignettes more is that it is designed to project the image on a much smaller sensor than the full size 35mm frame.

Looking at your photo, how do you hold the whole setup? It would have been extremely helpful if it had some sort of top handle.

Can you please describe your shooting position?

Alastair - The extreme is big and heavy for the hv20. If you're wanting portability then the mini might be just what you need.
The adapter itself has a thread on the bottom that attaches it to the rail support but I don't know the size.
Great find on the hv20 to rails support bracket. I'll have to check that out.

Yang - I'll know more about how I'll hold it in practical shooting situations after this weekend. I'm planning on bringing it along with me to a wedding to play around a bit. Right now I'm holding it much like a football with my right hand under the adapter itself and the underside of the camera support resting on my forearm. When I need to go higher, I'll just rest the back of the rails on my shoulder supporting the front rails with my right hand and focusing with my left. Very ENG camera esque. I also see myself busting out the tripod a lot with it. I'll know a little more after this weekend.

Oh and guys, I'm going away for a while. I really need to get some work done.