Looks like they finally made the right decision. Avid is dropping AvidXpressPro, and merging it with Media Composer - at a competitive price with FCP.

Looks like the 'upgrade' to Media Composer for those of us with AXP will be about five hundred dollars - much cheaper than the old 'upgrade' path.


http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/film/news/e3i177ff2f002836eceb5d837679fe95bb6

Excellent. Thanks Richard.

http://www.avid.com/company/releases/2008/080317_newthinking_avid.html

They finally listened to Mr. Alvarez!!!!!!!!! For the record Richard has been saying Avid should drop Xpress for a while.

I'll certainly make the move. FINALLY.

David

Yes, yes... they finally took my advice seriously. In fact, any day now the check for my services should arrive in the mail.

I'm really stoked about this. Media Composer is the way to go. I'm only worried my old system won't run it. Sigh, a five hundred dollar upgrade, but another three grand for a new system. Well, it's a good excuse to go with that MacBook Pro I've been wanting. Since AVID ships with copies for MAC and PC, It's the next purchase. I need a good high end editing laptop.

We agree. Avid has been working on this a while. I think it was gong to be the big February announcement. New management wanted to call a time out and make sure the plan was solid. It is.

We haven't been able to update our website yet, but I have changed the prices in the cart. If you click through on the upgrade, it will be at $495.

We hopeto have new deals on bundles with MojoSDI as well. My goal is to get all new Avid pricing updated within next 24 hours.

I posted more details on this and other Avid programs int he industry news section.

GO AVID!

Gary
http://www.videoguys.com/avid.html

Looks good Gary. I've got to take a look at my system specs, but I'll likely be upgrading today or tomorrow.

WooHooo!

To be clear, what's included in the upgrade? Media discs? Manuals?

Rich,

The $495 upgrade includes full manuals and dics. It also includes the 3rd party software - Boris Continuum, Sorenson, and Sonic DVD authoring.

It's the same exact software and upgrade we had in stock last week, only dramatically more affordable!

http://www.videoguys.com/mcfamily.html

Gary

HOLY MOLEY! Thats a STEAL!

I'm on it like a chicken on a junebug.

My NASA client just got Avid Xpress early last week. Now I hope I can talk them into the upgrade as well. Spectramatte alone is well worth it. I think it is hands down one of the best keyers out there. Never had one problem.

Richard, I've noticed that Media Composer (at TVP post house) runs super fast, and it is on an old G5 Mac. I noticed especially that imports tended to run faster. The good thing is that the code is really tight on MC and you shouldn't have to get a super beefy machine to run it. In fact, I bet it would run great on an iMac with a G-raid FW 800 if you're editing HDV.

Of course, if you've got the money, it would scream on a OCtoMac.

BTW Richard, I was able to take a project from my Xpress Pro on my HP notebook with eSATA card and Seagate 300 and consolidate flawlessly to my clients' new Xpress 5.8 MAc setup and 1 TB G-raid. Now we're talking about 200GB's of media. I then installed Xpress on a new HP that they purchased and I was able to move back and forth between Mac and PC w/o a hitch. All i had to do was move the dongle and the project file.

Cheers.

word of caution: MC Soft will not yet run on Leopard or Vista.

Avid's working on it and I know they will have it as soon as they can. For today it's Tiger or XP only.

Gary

Gary

Its a done deal, you have my money. The additional 5% off was a sweet deal to.

I am REALLY stoked. The thrid party apps alone make it a terrific deal, it's like a free upgrade to MC for me!

I'm running XP, and I'm not in any hurry to move to Vista... so all is good at this point.

Richard

Just for a lark, I went back to the AVID forum and found my post from OCTOBER FIRST 2006- SEVENTEEN MONTHS AGO.

Am I a prophet or what?

____________________________

As someone who re-entered the video world after a fifteen year abscence back in '01, I shopped around the NLE market. FCP was definately out, as I had no interest in Macs, and all my other software was PC. I wanted to be able to edit FILM, dammit, and learn skills that would translate UP to the broadcast/film market. BUT money was tight.

Avid XpressDV was my choice, but WITH THE POWER PACK. Seems like I paid $2300 or so for the deal.

Fast forward over many 'upgrades' and I have shelled out an additional five hundred or so dollars... and I still have Avid XPress Pro. Yeah, it chapped me royaly to see the 'bonus pack' included after I shelled out extra bucks for it. Meanwhile, I watched the Indy market and the 'boutique' houses all go with FCP.

Recently, I went to a User Group meeting here in San Francisco. There were probably twenty five to thirty users there. AND THEY WERE GIVING AWAY A FREE COPY OF MEDIA COMPOSER as incentive. I know that's why I went.

MOST in attendance were all over forty. Lots had broadcast experience. There were almost no 'young, hip, indy' types in the audience.

I've got to tell you, it looked like a room full of dinosaurs. Yeah, I'm fifty one... so add me in. But I've been 'burned' by upgrades, paying more, and seeing others get more for their money when they buy in for the first time. I can understand Avid's dillemma of protecting the high end who've already spent a bundle.

They announced... FINALLY and probably too late, a great effort to get back into the media schools by offereing composer for educational institutions for 250 dollars a copy.

They even made a half hearted effort, by offering great deals like the recent 'upgrade' to MC for 2500.

Sorry Avid. These are half measures. You are shovelling against the tide.

Here's my sincere take on what needs to be done.

One product.

Period.

Scalable with hardware.

Period.

So this means everyone owns a copy of "Media Composer" software. ( I really DON'T think you should rename it.)

What's the big fear? The big fear is that you will piss off people who are already bought in. How to avoid that?

I don't know the actual profit margins involved, so I'll just have to toss around numbers. But I know that if Avid is willing to let copies go to institutions at 250, and special promotions at 2500 for FULL COPIES of MC WITH BORIS -

It. Can. Be. Done.

Here's what I think. You offer a 'consolidation' deal. Everyone WITH XpressPro gets it 'upgraded' or 'unlocked' or whatever it takes to get Media Composer for... oh, I'd go for five hundred dollars. That's double your price for your institutional copies.

Oh, but what about all those people who just spent five grand on THEIR copy of Media Composer???

Simple. All they have to do is provide proof they've bought it at full retail price, and they can BUY A SINGLE ADDITIONAL COPY OF SOFTWARE ONLY for Five hundred bucks. THis is a ONE TIME ONLY OFFER>SO all the stations and boutique shops who had the Extra scratch to get MC in the first place, can now be placated by owning TWO copies.

So for an additional $500 dollars, those with Express Pro get their copy upgraded to MC. And those with MC get a SECOND COPY for $500.

And the final result? Everyone on the same page. Everyone with the ability to scale by purchasing faster computers, Mojo, Adrenaline, Decklink, Aja, whatever...

Just. Like. Final Cut Pro.

And everyone is editing on the FULL INDUSTRY STANDARD NLE - Unlike FCP (at least for the moment.)

Do it.

Trust me.

I have AvidXpress Pro Hd 5.2. I went to Vista and found out too late that Avid will not run on Vista. So I have not loaded 5.2.

How could I upgrade if Avid 5.2 is not on my computer?

Jim

Jim,

Are you saying you have Vista loaded as your OS? If so, then you wont be able to run AXP or MC. You will have to rollback to XP in order to load either program.

Alternately, you could simply wait for support for VISTA with MC. But there's no telling how long that will take. If you need to be editing now, then roll back your OS (or dual boot) to XP, and load AXP or MC.

Jim,

Are you saying you have Vista loaded as your OS? If so, then you wont be able to run AXP or MC. You will have to rollback to XP in order to load either program.

Alternately, you could simply wait for support for VISTA with MC. But there's no telling how long that will take. If you need to be editing now, then roll back your OS (or dual boot) to XP, and load AXP or MC.

Yeah I was afraid of that,Vista is my OS now. I may have to dual boot. Right now I am using Edius 4.5 and for some reason it runs fine on Vista even thought it is made for WinXP.
If I wait for support for Vista I still will not have Avid 5.2 on my system so how to I show I am eligible for MC upgrade?

Avid uses a dongle. When you upgrade to MC your dongle gets blasted from X Pro to MC Soft. That's what makes the upgrade work.

You install the MC Software fresh on any machine. If you don't have an MC dongle, it don't run.

Interesting tidbit.:You can install MC on as many machine as you want, PC and or Mac. You can only run it on one machine at a time, but you can move the dongle to any machine you want.

Gary

BTW - we've updated our Avid pages to reflect the "New Thinking" campaign and the new price promotion on MC Soft. We've also put together some killer bundles with the Mojo SDI hardware.

http://www.videoguys.com/avid.html

Gary

Avid uses a dongle. When you upgrade to MC your dongle gets blasted from X Pro to MC Soft. That's what makes the upgrade work.

You install the MC Software fresh on any machine. If you don't have an MC dongle, it don't run.

Interesting tidbit.:You can install MC on as many machine as you want, PC and or Mac. You can only run it on one machine at a time, but you can move the dongle to any machine you want.

Gary


Ok...I do have the Avid 5.2 dongle. You are saying if I have the dongle in my USB port MC will recognize it and then install?

kind of. the upgrade is two parts.

Part 1 - Dongle updater. You have to run through a process that converts your X Pro dongle into an MC dongle

Part 2 - The MC Software. You install it. It will not run without an MC dongle.

Gary

kind of. the upgrade is two parts.

Part 1 - Dongle updater. You have to run through a process that converts your X Pro dongle into an MC dongle

Part 2 - The MC Software. You install it. It will not run without an MC dongle.

Gary


Ok...thanks. That helps.

Jim

We've been getting lots of questions from X Pro owners on why they should upgrade for $495. This is from our new Avid page on our website:

Media Composer is more then just the world’s best video editor, it is an integrated post production solution! Here are some of our favorite integrated plug-ins and feature included with Media Composer:

- FluidFilm™ and FluidMotion™ - Create incredibly smooth slow-motion effects and “fit-to-fill" video using patented FluidMotion pixel morphing technology while you control speed and position using intuitive curve-based keyframing.

- 8-point Motion Tracker system for advanced tracking operations including offset tracks, applicable to most real-time and non-real-time effect operators

- Patented SteadyGlide™ technology to remove image shakiness while preserving desirable camera motion like pans and tilts.

- Real-time 16-bit SpectraMatte™ keying featuring SpectraGraph™ Viewer Chroma keying is a fundamental element in compositing and everybody needs it.

- AniMatte™ toolset for fast matte key creation within the editor

- Scratch Removal – remove unwanted imperfections in your footage

- Fully customizable TimeWarp effects

- Multicamera Editing with Multigroup capability for grouping multiple “banks" of camera angles. Multicam is available at any Avid resolution from single field to uncompressed.

- ScriptSync™ for incredibly fast matching of source clips to a text script or transcript.

- Blend Effects including Real-time 3D warp with 23 customizable parameters and Blur effect for deep defocus of images and keys with alphas

When you order Media Composer (full version $2495 or Upgrade $495) you also get these fantastic 3rd party software titles to make your post production workflow even stronger! Academic version ($295) does not include 3rd party software.

1) Boris Continuum Complete AVX – A powerful add-on package with more than 160 filters, including: Lens Flare, Glint, Match Grain, DeInterlace, Optical Flow, Motion Blur, Wire Remover, and Witness Protection effects.

2) SmartSound Sonic Fire Pro 4 with Mood Mapping. Create rich, multi-layered royalty free soundtracks for your productions. You also get 2 Strata Series Multi-track Libraries Core Foundations and Core Sessions.

3) Sorenson Squeeze Compression Suite 4.5 with Sorenson Video 3 Pro, Sorenson Spark Pro, Sorenson MPEG-4 Pro & Sorenson AVC Pro. Easily encode your videos into multiple formats while maintaining the highest possible video quality.

4) Sonic DVDit6 authoring software. Create standard definition DVDs with motion menus and interactive navigation. DVDit6 is Windows only.

VIDEOGUYS' TECH NOTE: Avid Media Composer is currently compatible with Windows XP Professional and Mac OSX (Tiger). We strongly recommend a Quadro FX graphics card FX1400/1500/1700 or higher. Windows Vista and Mac OSX Leopard are not supported but are in development.

Gary
http://www.videoguys.com/avid.html

Its a terrific upgrade, and a fantastic price. Most of the third party apps are worth the price alone, if purchased independently.

Here's a question for you Gary, I might ask it on the Avid board too. I'm not 100% certain my current PC will run MC, I'm mostly worried about the graphics card as the processors and ram are fine. So I'm considering buying a Macbook Pro - which would run the MC copy just fine and dandy.

When I update the dongle to MC, will it still allow my version of AXP to run on my Desktop? In other words, once the dongle is updated to MC, can I run my copy of MC on a notebook with it, then shift the dongle back to my older PC and run the copy of AXP I have on it?

I'm guessing the answer is "NO" but hoping it might be "Answer Hazy, ask again later"

Finally, took Avid long enough. Still horrible that Vista and Leopard aren't supported, but that should be coming soon. Avid also needs to support AVCHD and the 24 Frame HDV flavors that have been massively neglected for codec support.

Final Cut Studio still is my baby, but seing the $295 Academic Price, I may pick it up once Leopard is supported and once there is a workflow for AVCHD.

Its a terrific upgrade, and a fantastic price. Most of the third party apps are worth the price alone, if purchased independently.

Here's a question for you Gary, I might ask it on the Avid board too. I'm not 100% certain my current PC will run MC, I'm mostly worried about the graphics card as the processors and ram are fine. So I'm considering buying a Macbook Pro - which would run the MC copy just fine and dandy.

When I update the dongle to MC, will it still allow my version of AXP to run on my Desktop? In other words, once the dongle is updated to MC, can I run my copy of MC on a notebook with it, then shift the dongle back to my older PC and run the copy of AXP I have on it?

I'm guessing the answer is "NO" but hoping it might be "Answer Hazy, ask again later"

Richard,

I upgraded my Studio Complete to MC back in January (before the new pricing, unfortunately). When I updated my dongle for MC, it just added the product key for MC and left the key for AXP intact. The MC install also left AXP on the system. I've been able to launch both products with no problem, though not at the same time obviously. I can't think of any reason I'd want to use AXP over MC in my case, but it shows that you shouldn't have any problems having AXP on one machine and MC on another and moving the dongle back and forth. Hope that helps. I'm sure Gary can weigh in to amplify or clarify, if needed.

Aloha

Excellent knews Larry, thanks! This will really help me decide whether I should go with the Macbook Pro, or just trade in my Workstation for a newer model. If it works both ways, I'll opt for the Macbook Pro. (Update the workstation later.)

yes, yes, i'm just trying to justify the macbook to the wife....


PS: Isn't there some sort of rebate/discount or such for recent MC purchase/upgrades? Check the Avid site.

PS: Isn't there some sort of rebate/discount or such for recent MC purchase/upgrades? Check the Avid site.

Yes there is: for customers who purchased after January 1, 2008. I purchased the upgrade in late December '07 and installed it in early January, so I'm out of luck. Oh well...

OUCH, I feel for ya Larry. Sooner or later we all get hit by the upgrade/deadline vulture. For myself, I originally bought Avid Xpress 3.5 WITH the 'Power Pack'. Paid something like 2300 in order to get the ability to cut film with it. Five months later, they INCLUDED the power pack, PLUS more third party software at a lower price.

Yeah, its a bummer.

Really, I'm trained on MC, and I just couldn't justify the 5k price way back then. They 'lowered' the MC upgrade to apx 2300 (still too rich for me) THEN appx 1300 (Damn, still too rich) and finally 499 - which means I get the MC I wanted all along, for less than the original price for when I got in. - Total expenditures for all Avid installs and upgrades to date - 3OOO, and I'll be running MC. So I don't feel TOO bad. It's not like I haven't made money with AXP as it is.

But that sort of upgrade squeeze hits everybody at some point. Look at those people who bought Iphones early.

I'm not certain but my guess is that MC still does not have secondary color correction compare to FCP, correct?

Chong,

No MC doesn't have secondary color correction. FCP doesn't have secondary color correction. Color does. So in FCP you have to export an entire sequence into Color, do your work, and then import back to FCP. Yo can't work shot to shot in your edit app or export singles into Color. I've worked through this process and I've found that you really need time to get into secondaries. 80% of the color correction you would ever require can be handled in primary color correction. For that extra 20% there are third party After Effects plugins like Color Finesse or Colorista (AVX and After Effects and FCP version).

Cheers.

Finally Avid's trying to catch up with Apple's pricing, better late than never. And those of us that have been "stuck" with Xpress due to the steep price tag for MC may now join the club, at last. I've just been waiting for Avid to make this move.

The next move though, hopefully, I'll guess will be a bit harder, the hardware issue. Avid's hardware for both monitoring SD and HD properly still is way to expensive.

I'm pretty sure they're working on their hardware lines. Part of the 'new thinking'. Time will tell.

David, thanks for clearing that for me. However, I would agree that Avid's hardware requirements are still quite expensive.

No doubt Chong. I'm pretty sure everyone would agree with you there.
It is expected that Avid will announce something on the hardware end soon.

After all, who wants to pay the price of a small car for an I/O box??

Cheers.

The "New Thinking" is starting to percolate though every aspect.

People complained that Avid had such a lock on 'proprietary' hardware, that it wouldn't open it's software to third party apps.

But apple is exactly the same way. FCP only runs on MAC's. That would make Final Cut Pros 'hardware requirements still quite expensive' to paraphrase. Why doesn't Apple release a PC version of the software? (Like AVID does.)

Simple. Apple is protecting it's 'high end hardware' - IE it's computers. THAT's where it makes its profit, not on the software, which has always been a 'loss-leader'. If people clammoured for Apple to unlock it's hardware so it could run on cheap PCs... well, never mind.

Avid has, to date, been trying to make a profit on it's software, and it's hardware. They are competing against APPLE and to a certain extent, third party hardware companies that make AJA and Black Magic. In essence, fighting a war on two fronts. (Remember you can BUY a MAC/AVID system directly from Avid. Can you buy a FCP/PC directly from Apple?)

Though maintaining a lead in high-end production film and broadcast houses, they were losing ground in middle market and indy shops - places where an extra five hundred dollars to a grand, makes a LOT more difference.

SO - what will 'the new thinking' bring?

Changes in the pricing of the 'mojo' I/O boxes I expect. But also, new 'boxes' that lie somewhere between the mojos and the adrenaline/nitris boxes. Solutions that will go head to head with Aja BlackMagic Decklink cards. If the thinking is truly NEW - then these new pieces of hardware will run with OTHER NLE apps. Remember, AVID purchased Pinnacle Systems - they used to manufacture the Cinewave Targa, remember??? In essence, Avid will take the fight to other hardware companies. It's either that, or cede the ground and open their coding for them.

Like I said, time will tell. But eighteen months ago, I correctly predicted what AVID had to do regarding AXP and MC.

Simple. Apple is protecting it's 'high end hardware' - IE it's computers. THAT's where it makes its profit, not on the software, which has always been a 'loss-leader'. If people clammoured for Apple to unlock it's hardware so it could run on cheap PCs... well, never mind.

That's only true to a certain degree, to guarantee Avid's stability you should buy a ceritified system. And if you want some real guarantee for the hardware to work and be replaced if not, you must buy a workstation. To date for example the HP Xw8400 system is more expensive than a equal mac, at least here in Northern Europe.

You can of course run Avid on a cheap homebuilt system, and in many cases that will work just fine, but in the long run with drivers and the possibility for hardware conflict it's not the safest bet.

One idea would be a sort of new mojo with HD capabilities to do simple monitoring and mastering. Then redesign the other DNA's, still for high end use.

Cheaper in the US, but my point remains. You can buy a certified PC or a certified MAC version of AVID. You can't do the same for FCP. Because they're protecting their 'high end' hardware IE the Mac.

I've been ruminating on Pinnacle Systems Targa board,(which is now the intellectual property of AVID) since I saw one sitting in the studio the other day.

I'm speculating - and I'm doing it here cause it's not 'allowed' on the official avid site - that we will see a rebirth of the Cinewave Card... in some incarnation. Call it the AVID CINEWAVE card. But like you said with the capabilities of monitoring HD. Also - imagine if it would run other NLE's as well. So you could have Premiere, with an AVID CINEWAVE card, or whatever. They'd be going head to head with Matrox, and AJA etc.

I really really hope Avid listens to Richard. I'm calling Richard the Avid Prophet.
Richard has a crystal ball with a big "A" on it. Just kidding.

Cool. I didn't know that about the Cinewave card being Pinnacle. I hope that they didn't throw away the technical docs. Avid has so much more potential.

Keep looking into that crystal ball. Maybe we'll an HD mojo for your efforts. I'd be willing to pay $1,500.

Keep looking into that crystal ball. Maybe we'll an HD mojo for your efforts. I'd be willing to pay $1,500.

I'll second that! I've got two Mojos, and a Mojo-SDI that I'd gladly trade for one HD Mojo that would provide I/O between HD and HDV cameras, decks, and an HD monitor. Making toast and/or coffee too would be a nice plus!

Pinnacle still makes a digital i/o box that will run with Premiere, and liquid but it won't work with AVID.

I'd think this is a doable goal. Not this year perhaps, but by next.