Hello everyone!

I'm a new and a novice fellow here with a small list of questions about stabilizer systems. My usage of a steadycam will be video only, and I've decided to go with the home-built route. To save money and material, I'm starting design ideas with cheaper materials for testing (wood, pvc, etc), and then moving to a full production rig using 6061 aluminum before I attach my real camera.

This is only and hobby, but I am trying to get the most accurate rig as possible. I've found the Home Built Stabilizer website, and DIY message boards, but what I need is some feedback from the PRO's about the use, and design of steadycams.

Specific questions are as follows:

Is there a technical advantage to manipulate the movement of the camera from above the Gimbal or below? (I want to use a foam grip and I need to know where I should attach it)

When attaching the sled onto an arm/vest combo, is there a bearing that allows the Gimbal handle to swivel at that attachment point? (This would be the bottom of the handle, not the top part that is already attached to the Gimbal using bearings)

From just observing pictures and videos of systems it looks like the sled is attached to the arm/vest system by just gravity. Do systems like the Pilot, or the Indicam have a hidden fastener to keep the camera sled securely mounted?

Is it better to attach the arm to the center of the vest, or to the side either left or right? (I'm right handed)

Thanks for any help and ideas!

David:

I am an avid DIYer, and steady camera rigs are starting to catch my eye, particularly because a director I work with asked about one in an upcoming film.

When ever I read articles on this stuff, you I have never gotten the low down on gimbals and balancing points, etc. Always the word is, it takes a lot of engineering to do it right. That makes me a bit more determined, but alas, with upcoming projects, I have to put that on back burner.

The simplest to build is one mimicking the SteadyCam Jr.

Also, you can actually buy a gimbal grip for it one at one of our sponsors, BH Photo. See this search result, for instance:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=search&A=search&Q=&shs=gimbal&ci=0

I sure would like to continue to follow your project, and see some photos, even if you don't continue to post here. If you would like to share info and ideas, PM me.

Here are some of my prototype bits.

Picture 1 shows the initial idea for the Gimbal and spring loaded arm. The Gimbal was redesigned and is nearing completion. I'm using a 2 1/2" bearing with a 1 1/8" inner bore (for the main post). I bought a clamping collar to hold the main bearing, which we milled and treaded to accept the side bearing shoulder bolt. CAD 1 is the new design of the Gimbal. As for the arm, we still have to work out the adjustment block for the counterweight spring. For the prototype we can adjust spring tension by moving the cable anchor pin up and down (picture 2), but we want to make this an infinitely adjustable screw mechanism. More to follow...

Picture 3 shows my 12V battery, power distribution block, and LCD monitor. The LCD was only $39.00 and the image quality really sucks, but it works fine for just framing and watching what you’re shooting. The power block will be used to supply power to the LCD and my LED video light I made (picture 4). Plus I needed a place to put a fuse and main power cut off switch. I also purchased a DC to DC converter to keep the power running to my LED light at a constant 12V so I don’t get any change in light output when the battery level drops.

We are busy redesigning the handle, and arm mounting assembly and would like some input about what we should work on (see above thread)

Also my cousin thinks the arm would not need bearings for smooth operation, where I believe every moving joint should have some sort of bearing for the smoothest action possible. Any feedback on that idea would be appreciated.

Thanks everyone, and I'll keep you up to date on our progress!

Dave

David:

Thanks for sharing with us.

1. Are going to use a single sprung arm, or have a second to allow for additional maneuvering ?

2. I started experimenting with a DIY gimbal, but having never actually seen one, am unclear how much resistance should be there. For a Steadicam Jr. type set up (hand held only) I used a polished carriage bolt head to agains flat aluminimun to balance the set up on. That arrangment give very little control in stopping the unit from moving one direction or the other, once it starts going that way. I ve also tried a using a 2 in caster with bearing to do a pivoting gimbal with similar dimensions to the photo you show. Again control seems to be the issue, plus the with the pivot and up and down articulation take place in different plains, there are issue arising there too.

As far as gimbal griip goes, and not having ever seen one actually, my thought is it has to turn and tilt freely in short range, but gradually add resistance as that range is extended so the shooter can recover the camera from an unintended direction it is floating.

Is that something you are trying to do ?

I will be using a second arm, I thought I would just build one prototype and duplicate it twice for the final rig. From what I've read Gimbals should have Zero resistance, that's why I'm using lots and lots of bearings and precision machining to keep friction to a minimum. We are machining the Gimbal so all bearings rotate on a center axis so there will be no offset rotation artifacts. But this is all speculation at this point because I have never actually held and played with a real steadycam system. You would think that a small amount of friction would be a good thing to keep the rig from floating away from you (like you were in Zero-G), but proper balancing should be the key for ultimate control.

Lots and lots to think about :) Let's have some FUN!

Dave

Hello Everyone,

This is my prototype lower stage. The finished product will be 6061 aluminum that will be anodized black. Since the LCD is so light, I had to add counterweights to help with the dynamic balance of the sled. I know that I'll have to be very careful to make sure both posts receive the same amount of weight so I'm not unbalancing the sled. Last night I ran my LCD and LED lights for over 2 hours straight before the battery dropped so low that the LCD started to fade out. I could have ran the LED lights for another hour after that without the LCD :)

Any feedback would be appreciated! Thanks.

Here is a short video that demonstrates my two basic arm designs. The first part is a simple spring arm (very bouncy); the second part is an Iso-elastic design. Soon I'll be completing a final arm prototype, and then I'll start the final build.

My Gimbal is complete, and I'm working on the final lower sled assembly. Pictures are soon to follow.

Dave

David,

I applaud you for all the work you have done so far. When you build your own rig, and you have the ability to do so correctly, you learn a great deal about stabilization that you never would have learned if you just bought a rig.

We started our first prototype in wood also. We then built a rig with aluminum using oil impregnated bronze bushings. It worked quite well but when we went with mini bearings it was a whole new ball game. The cost was a whole new ball game as well but well worth it. We have to credit Martin Stevens (President of Glidecam) for this suggestion. This was before Glidecam had made an arm (Smoother Shooter) to carry their 2000 and 4000 pro sleds.

Most steadicam operators hold the post just under the gimbal with their fingers spread out on the gimbal sleeve which, in your case and our case, is made out of foam. This is because the bottom part of the post has more room for your hand and if you feel the sled sway at all on acceleration/deceleration or direction changes you can make any necessary corrections.

Our our system the sled is indeed held on by gravity and can move around if needed (no bearing).

We found through lots of research that our sled works well in conventional steadicam configuration which is-the connection point (socket block) is on the right side so the sled is held more on the left side. We have had a couple of customers who switched it just the opposite (socket block on the left with the sled held on the right). While there are a few advantages to this configuration, we prefer the standard set up. Others out there will have their own preferences.

We hope this helps.

Tery
Indicam

Thanks Terry!

Great insite into the fun world of make-it-up-as-you-go-along. Things would be different if I had the hands on experience first before designing my own rig. Of course after using my homebuilt system for a while, I'll be redesigning parts over and over again.

If there is anybody in the Michigan/Ohio area that has a full rig, (and some spare time) mabey we can compare notes.

I'll be checking back often!

Dave

Hello everyone,

Here is the updated progress report. My Gimbal is finished, and the Lower Sled is 90% complete. Both units will be disassembled and anodized before final assembly. Looking forward to starting my Upper Sled soon!

Dave

David,

Nice work! It's great when you have access to a lot of good tools.

Tery
Indicam

Thanks Tery, or is it Terry?

I received your DVD, and like it a lot! Good points, tips, and practice techniques. I must admit that after watching your DVD I've already redesigned some of my system. This is such a dynamic field that I'm sure I will be forever inspecting, modifying, and improving my system for years to come.

Thanks again!

Dave

Dave,

You're right about the redesigning thing. We waited three years to release our system because we wanted it to be everything we liked in a system in our market...and it is.

It's tuff when you redesign in a business as you have to order many parts in bulk and then, when you don't use the exact same part, you have a bunch of them sitting around. We've got so many different kinds of hardware in our shop that we can't hardly find our way around.

Since you are building one system for yourself and have the tools to do so, you should be in great shape.

It's too bad you live in the Land of Mayor McCheese...I'd like to see your project in person.

Tery
Indicam

David,

Thanks for sharing that video demo of the simple spring vs iso-elastic design. I never realized how much of a big difference it makes!

From my own experiences:
- It's not desirable for the sled to rotate around the mounting point to the vest/arm. I actually like to lock mine down or else the sled has a tendency to collide with your arm at certain angles like doing a low shot or high shot.
- Traditionally, the sled is mounted to either side rather than at center. It's more a matter of preference if you use an external LCD. If not, most camcorders have an LCD that flips out on the left side of the camera so you'd get better viewing angles by mounting the arm on the left side of the vest so that the sled comes to the right side of your body.
- One of my favorite features on Tery's Indicam Pilot is the adjustable gimbal :) You can fine tune the drop time and quickly change into low mode just by sliding the gimbal up or down.

From your photos, it looks like your little challenge is turning out quite nicely ;)

I look forward to seeing updates on your progress!

Peter

Thanks Peter,

My Gimbal will also be adjustable; I've just not finished that part yet. Since my camera (Canon GL2) has the small LCD on the left side, I'll locate my arm on my right side. I’ll be using the lower LCD for when I can’t see the camera LCD.

According to Charles Papert, there is an inherent danger with the sled drifting away from you and pulling you over, so I'm not going to use bearings in my mount posts, only in the arm elbow joint. With a small amount of friction, and a couple of springs, my hope is to keep the sled close to my body. For the first few practice runs with my finished rig I'm going to fly dead weight, and I intend to purposely see if I can get myself off-balance. I'll be decked out in my rollerblade pads to keep from getting hurt :)

More to follow!

Dave

David, even though I'm no expert on these things, maybe I can give a bit of advice on a few of your decisions.

First of all, since you have a big LCD and a nice battery, why not use them for your framing? Your camera can output information over its video signal, so you wouldn't even lose the overlays you have on your LCD. LCDs on Steadicams are in the place they are for multiple reasons, primarily to give balance to the sled, but also so that the operator can watch his footing while walking, and still pay attention to the shot. It allows your peripheral vision to be directed at the surroundings that matter. Peter Abraham, in talking to us in the workshop I just took said that very rarely does one walk unexpectedly into a beam at eye level, but it's often that there will be treacherous things on the ground. It's better to be looking down there to avoid them.

As to being worried about your sled pulling you over, yes that is a slight concern, probably not as much with a rig of the weight you're talking about though. I'd be more worried about the arm being properly machined, and being able to absorb shocks both laterally and vertically rather than trying to create friction to keep it from running away from you. With the higher-end rigs, you can adjust the "pitch" of the arm connector, to steer it so that it rests directly in front of you while you're standing in the proper position (leaning very slightly back and to the right). Getting the proper lean down is a bit difficult at first though, so I'd strongly suggest taking a workshop if at all possible. It'll save you some headaches. You might be able to devise a simple way of adjusting the pitch of the arm pin into your design, but if not, I'm not sure that adding friction will produce a desirable result.

About mounting the arm to one side or another - try both. Really. One will probably make more sense to you. Unless you truly have no preference, I wouldn't base it upon which side of the camera will give you what you want, you can always turn the camera with the left side facing you between shots if you need to adjust something.

Good luck with your project.

Hey Thanks Tom!

You’re absolutely correct about having the vest adjustments for the arm, and I will have a pitch adjustment. As for the sled pulling ME over, not likely, I'm 6' 3" and built like a football linebacker, but anything is possible.

Workshops are out of the question unless they show up in the Detroit/Toledo area. There is no way I could take a vacation and not spend all day without my wife :)

I did buy the Indicam DVD, and I'm looking forward to trying some practice drills they have. I should also be buying the EFP DVD soon, and can start watching that as well.

I feel a bit alone with all of this for where I live, but everyone who helps me out on these message boards I'm greatly appreciative, thanks to everyone!

Dave

There is no way I could take a vacation and not spend all day without my wife :)

Now here's a man who's got his priorities straight! :) Props to you, David!

Hello Everyone again!

It's been a while since I've last updated about my sled progress. Life takes precedence over hobbies, so things have been progressing slow these last few months. One major advance is that I have completed the Top Stage!

I decided it would be best to use the Manfrotto 3419 micro-adjustable plate for the upper part of the top stage, but the bottom was going to have to be a custom build. I like the idea of the micro-adjust for ease of balancing my sled, so I came up with this design. The dovetail plate was machined to .001" tolerance, so there is little to almost Zero play. After anodizing, I'll have to recheck tolerance to make sure nothing is binding. The brass threaded rod is silky smooth, and the bronze clamp makes sure everything is locked tight so there is no movement. I still have to drill a hole for the Main Post mounting hardware and the outlet hole for the power cable from the Lower Stage battery, but it's 95% finished.

Next will be the finishing touches on the Gimbal handle, milling a slot into the Main Post for my wires, and a final fit and finish before anodizing. The end of the road is getting nearer, and I'm looking forward to going "Flying" for the first time :)

Till later,

Dave

Hello Everyone again!

It's been a while since I've last updated about my sled progress. Life takes precedence over hobbies, so things have been progressing slow these last few months. One major advance is that I have completed the Top Stage!

I decided it would be best to use the Manfrotto 3419 micro-adjustable plate for the upper part of the top stage, but the bottom was going to have to be a custom build. I like the idea of the micro-adjust for ease of balancing my sled, so I came up with this design. The dovetail plate was machined to .001" tolerance, so there is little to almost Zero play. After anodizing, I'll have to recheck tolerance to make sure nothing is binding. The brass threaded rod is silky smooth, and the bronze clamp makes sure everything is locked tight so there is no movement. I still have to drill a hole for the Main Post mounting hardware and the outlet hole for the power cable from the Lower Stage battery, but it's 95% finished.

Next will be the finishing touches on the Gimbal handle, milling a slot into the Main Post for my wires, and a final fit and finish before anodizing. The end of the road is getting nearer, and I'm looking forward to going "Flying" for the first time :)

Till later,

Dave


looks a little heavy.
But please dont tell us that you gave up on this DIY challenge.

Nope, didn't give up. It weighs only 16 oz alone, or 32 oz with the Manfrotto micro-adjust plate.

We have been busy refining the little detail of the sled, and waiting for my cousin to finish rebuilding his 1933 11" Southbend lathe...

All this work does take time, it is definitely easier to just buy an already complete sled, but not quite as much fun :)

More to come SOON!!!!

Hello Everyone

What a proud moment to be able to finally post here! After 11 months of on-again, off-again fabrication, my FINISHED sled is here!

Final specs are:

Empty sled weight with LCD, but without battery and counterweights = 10 lbs (4.54 Kilos)

Fully loaded sled as shown = 20 lbs! (9.07 Kilos)

Obviously if I fly this thing for more then 30 seconds, my arm will fall off SO the next build will be the vest and my ISO-Arm.

Wish me luck!!

p.s. A great thanks to all that have inspired me, and have helped me by answering my questions. Please feel free to comment about anything about my sled, you may only help me make it even better.

David,

We would like to thank you for all the info and great pictures you posted. Your design looks well done but you will want (need) the support system.

Keep us informed on your progress there. If you need any information just post the questions here and the great minds of this forum will answer.

Soon you'll be the one giving the answers.

Tery
Indicam

Thanks Tery, I'll be starting a new thread with the vest and arm once I get going on the final design. I'm getting everything anodized today so I'll have some new pics of the sled a little later.

Thanks for all your help as well, and good luck with the Indicam!!

Dave

Here is the final sled after anodizing. I'm very happy with the final look, plus the anodizing makes everything slide very smoothly.

Enjoy,
Dave

Dave,

Wow, that is a lot of work you have accomplished. Let us know how well it operates. What camera are you going to use on it again...?

Tery
Indicam

Hey Terry,

I'll be flying a Canon GL2, and maybe a Canon HV30. Next up is the Iso-arm, so I'm still a bit away from flying...

Dave

I added weights, maybe 1 or 2 mm steel bird shot. No footage from it as of yet. I thought about a pivot bearing but may add that later. The foam became a pivot surface. I would like to add a quick disconnect.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/gary-szunyogh-albums-diy-redneck-steady-stick-progress-picture175-steady-1.jpg

David's project seems to be going very well; fine workmanship resulting in nice-looking gear. This is a DIY that I've been interested it for a while, but I've come to realize it beyond my level of expertise.

This time I don't want a DIY, I want a DISE (Do It Somebody Else)!

now THAT is one sexy rig. Thankyou for sharing this great bit of your success.

JS

Hello,

I'm very impressed by your design. Very nice.
Could you post some dimensions of your design? I'm planning to make my own steadicam, based on your design.

Thanks in advance,
GL Vanlier

Sorry, but I do not have any detailed plans for my rig. All parts were machined on-the-fly. Quite a bit of the rig was designed by what parts we had available, so to duplicate it would be a challenge.

David,
I applaud your effort in making your own steadicam-like device. However, after seeing your photos of the lower sled, I think you may experience a problem. The length from the front tip to the back of your lower sled is too long. When flying a camera, it's best to keep the rig as close to your body as possible. Many times you'll have to turn the camera as you're shooting. With the sled that long, you'll end up hitting your legs as you try to rotate the camera. Try shortening the overall length front to back.

Hey David. How come I do not have any pics of your system up on HBS? Hint Hint.

Hi David,

I'm looking at the X-10 at $2000 vs trying to make an arm myself. Your wood prototype and video makes it look doable, but I was wondering how complicated it got for you.

I was looking at a windsurfing hook belt and thinking that it might be an inexpensive way to incorporate an arm for a DLSR system I built from D. Eric Franks: DIY Steadicam - Flying Camera Support (http://videopia.org/watch/learn-mainmenu-231/205-diy-steadicam-flying-camera-support). Thoughts?

Just found this thread. Too bad David never posted the arm build as he did with the other parts. I would love to see how it turned out. Don’t you have any pics from the arm?
One quick question David. Being a homebuilt rig, does it work ok?

David,

Just checking in to see how you major build is going?
We are all impressed that you have done so much.
Now we want to see some video of your rig in action when you can shoot some.

Tery

Hey Gang,

Still here. Been a busy little boy with my new little boy :) I have been itching to get back to the rig and finish the arm, hopefully by summer. I have switched cameras to a Canon HFS100, so it's quite a bit lighter, but still to heavy to hold it handheld. As soon as I get some new stuff I will post it immediately. Thanks for keeping me in your thoughts :)

Just revisited this thread and was wondering how you came up with the iso-elastic design of your arm.

Also, can you make adjustments for different loads or how would you make it work with different configurations?

Hey Peter,

That design is not mine, I just copied it from a different site your familiar with (HBS group). I wont be using that arm, I'm not going to be able to tinker with the project enough to try to perfect it so I'll be going with just a standard arm. My idea is to have a sliding block that will be threaded so I can micro adjust the amount of tension I will need to fly my camera. It's still a ways off, but I am thinking more and more about the design every day, so maybe I can get a prototype done soon. Keep in touch!

Dave

I found the thread at HBS, thanks!

What is wrong with that arm that has made you abandon it? Your demo video is quite impressive vs the non-iso-elastic Steadicam arm on my Pilot... the Pilot arm doesn't stay in place but always wants to go back to it's equilibrium point.

David looking fon gimbal only,your gimbal is nice ( Gimbal (3).jpg) how much the gimbal only?

David, do you sell the gimbal and handle assembly?