As I mentioned on a previous post, I am gearing up to do some man-on-the-street interviews for a Christian-themed program I'm doing with my brand new A1. The end product will mostly end up on DVD (NTSC), some TV and some internet-based.

Is there a any kind of industry standard for choosing what frame rate to record at? I don't plan on ever turning these into some indy film production, but I would like to anticipate for converting some to PAL at a later point.

Is it a matter of taste, or is there a clear winner that looks best for informational-type videos like I'm doing? (These will be similar to like what on-scene reporters do for the news.).

I've read through scores of different threads on this and just when I think I should go one way, I get more and more confused. Any help on this would be much appreciated!

Sorry if I posted this in the wrong forum. This is my second post.

If it's about an A1, you got the right forum.

For your NTSC work I can't think of a better format to shoot in but 60i HDV, then cut it down to SD in post.

It looks smoother, camera movement isn't an issue unless it's gross and all round I think the way to go.

I am very fuzzy about converting that to PAL however, so I'll let one of the other members clue us both up about that.


CS

PS. Welcome to DVinfo, BTW.

Thanks for the reply. As far as the PAL part goes, I actually have no plans at all to convert anything to PAL. It's more of a thing of mine that I like to plan for the unknown as much as I can.

I may never do anything in PAL, but if for some unknown reason I need to go back over a few seasons' worth of videos and convert a NTSC program to PAL, I'd like to have the peace of mind that I wouldn't have to reshoot everything! :)

An ounce of prevention.....

If it's about an A1, you got the right forum.

For your NTSC work I can't think of a better format to shoot in but 60i HDV, then cut it down to SD in post.

It looks smoother, camera movement isn't an issue unless it's gross and all round I think the way to go.


Is this what most news casts are done in? Do you know? I think that's the look I'm going for, but I'm open for suggestions.

Thanks for your reply.

TV news in the U.S. is 60i and the lighting is very flat and even between background and foreground.

Does the same thing go for reality shows? 60i?

I think most of what you see on TV that's video-originated (except for independent movies) would be 60i. All the narratives would probably be shot at 24 fps, whether film or HD.

In my opinion you should always shoot 60i. Its the broadcast and DVD distribution standard and will give you more options and less headache in post. I think you'd also have the easiest time going to PAL if needed.

I think the 24fps video thing is a ridiculous joke played on gullible new shooters, an out-of control trend based on hype rather than actual results. 24fps HD looks bad more often than it looks good.

I would have to point out that 24P is made to look bad only by those who don't know how to shoot with it properly. Unfortunately there is a *lot* of lousy looking 24P video, but in the right hands, somebody who knows what they're doing can really make 24P sing.

I do agree that 24P should be avoided by those who are relatively new to video production in general.

Why? Is there some special technique to using 24p? where do I find out more?

I've just tried 24p for flying birds after getting weird artifacts using 50i (I'm using PAL) and the flight shots look a lot better.

Presumably I should be using the same thing all the time, so if that is going to be 24p, then I need to know what I'm up against.

Thanks

I normally shoot underwater and generally use 50i, but have had awesome results with 25f... I love it. Only issue is when I have to mix it up in the time line and then it's a real pain. I will probably shoot mostly in 50i but definately experiment as you can get great results.

Im getting great results with 24f in sd, but with 24f hd its another story. Going to take more tweaking to get it where i want it.

[QUOTE=Travis Breitenbach]In my opinion you should always shoot 60i. Its the broadcast and DVD distribution standard and will give you more options and less headache in post./QUOTE]



The only thing I don't like about 60i is the home video look. 24p looks too choppy in my low-skilled hands, but 60i looks like America's Funniest Home Videos to me. Is 30f the happy middle ground for me? If so, can the HV20 also record in that like the A1?

Am I the only one that sees "amateur home video" written over it every time you see something in 60i? Maybe I'm being overly picky on my own stuff...

Lloyd, when you say 60i looks like home video.. you can make HDV more filmy by a few simple things, I am definitley no expert but here is a few ideas:

White balance: Don't use auto, use manual or set to the temp of your lights depending on the look you want.

Exposure: Use Zebra to make sure that you are not over exposing the shot.

Focus: Use manual to stop the 'hunting' and use the long end of the lens to reduce the DOF for that subject in focus background out of focus. Put some motion in front of your subject again to give the shot more depth.

Use different camera angles: Low, pan to reveal, use exposure to reveal on the pan.

just some ideas...

Cheers

Jon

The only thing I don't like about 60i is the home video look. 24p looks too choppy in my low-skilled hands, but 60i looks like America's Funniest Home Videos to me. Is 30f the happy middle ground for me? If so, can the HV20 also record in that like the A1?

Am I the only one that sees "amateur home video" written over it every time you see something in 60i? Maybe I'm being overly picky on my own stuff...


I've seen lots of 60i that you couldn't tell was 60i. Frames aren't everything, as said probably 100,000 times on this site. It's lighting, camera movement, DOF, sound, and a good subject that makes it. Add a 35mm adapter and they'll be guessing forever. My lastest video, USNR#1 was shot in 60i and looks no where near like home video, even before post.

Not knowing your stuff, I can't say if it looks like home video or not. But I know what looks good to me, and it nearly always says something about the competency of the videographer rather than the equipment he or she was using. I'm always over-critical of my own stuff - often asking myself "when will I learn not to do . . . ."?

What is your definition of looking like a home video? Using inappropriate equipment or techniques or camera settings? Not using a tripod? Or just not getting the shot looking the way you want?

If 60i always looked like home video, it wouldn't be used as a broadcast quality standard.

Ive seen 60i footage that had a nice film look to it after post. Im still trying to decide whether im going to shoot in 60 24 or 30.

Why not test those modes and see what you mesh with best?

If 60i always looked like home video, it wouldn't be used as a broadcast quality standard.

Maybe that's my problem. I see some news interviews that look like a home video, so maybe I'm overly picky.

See, my recordings are basically man-on-the-street interviews; not a whole lot different than a news field interview. I'm just starting to add a light-screen person when I can, and I see that helping a bit.

I guess I don't know really what it is... Maybe it's just me.

Ive seen 60i footage that had a nice film look to it after post. Im still trying to decide whether im going to shoot in 60 24 or 30.

Yep, Mike. That's what I'm doing now.

I plan on making these interviews into a DVD series, so what I do on DVD #1 should be what I'm still using on DVD #20, otherwise that WOULD look bad for sure.

It looks like it's probably going to be 60i since I can't seem to get 24f right. I'm still getting all my samples together, but I need to draw the line soon and just go with what is working.

Yeah so far ive gotton pretty good results from the 24f sd but with hd its going to take alot more tweaking and im still getting used to the a1.

My friends love the camera though and so do i. Cant wait to play around with it more.

Unfortunately there is a *lot* of lousy looking 24P video, but in the right hands, somebody who knows what they're doing can really make 24P sing.


What kinds of techniques contribute to 24P looking good?

What kinds of techniques contribute to 24P looking good?

Not moving the camera too fast and all over the place for one... This I DO know.

I would have to point out that 24P is made to look bad only by those who don't know how to shoot with it properly. Unfortunately there is a *lot* of lousy looking 24P video, but in the right hands, somebody who knows what they're doing can really make 24P sing.

I do agree that 24P should be avoided by those who are relatively new to video production in general.

Chris, I'm curious to hear techniques to make 24p or 24f (I have an XH-A1) look its best? Or any other sources?

Same as any other video: Good composition, good lighting, decent camera moves.

I'm also curious about why 24p specifically is noted as more challenging.

I have found (in my limited experience) you have to be careful panning the camera - it isn't very forgiving. But I can't say knowledgably that it isn't a challenge in all formats.

And for footage you may want to do slow motion effects on - even if you shoot 24p regularily - is it best practice to shoot those scenes at 30p or 60i?

Trish

I'm also curious about why 24p specifically is noted as more challenging.

I have found (in my limited experience) you have to be careful panning the camera - it isn't very forgiving. But I can't say knowledgably that it isn't a challenge in all formats.

And for footage you may want to do slow motion effects on - even if you shoot 24p regularily - is it best practice to shoot those scenes at 30p or 60i?

Trish

Hi Trish. Movement of the subject can also look bad in 24p if care is not taken. For example, a car moving quickly from left to right is just as juddery as a fast pan. So if you pan with the movement the car would look fine and only the background would judder, which should be less obvious.

And if you know you are going to apply slo-mo, it is much better to shoot 60i to begin with, for that shot.

Richard

Thanks Richard!

That's exactly the kind of info the newbies could use more of (such as myself).

A shooting mode hints and tips primer would make a great sticky.

This forum, thanks to the generous sharing of knowledge and experience is an educational goldmine.

However, the more I learn around here, the more I realize how much more there is to know. : )

Trish

Same as any other video: Good composition, good lighting, decent camera moves.

Are there any techniques unique to 24p/f, other than being careful when panning? Also, strobing while panning can happen with other 30p too, no?