I was curious how the latest updates to FCP improved digitizing JVC's implementation of HDV so I did some testing on 720p60 and 720p24.

Up until this point I have been using the Intensity Pro and digitizing as ProRes via HDMI out of the JVC deck.

Anyway I can report that HDV over firewire now works (at all frame rates) but I am getting a 10 second gap between takes. I know this was widely reported before the update but I was wondering if anyone has been able to digitize with less of a gap? I can deal with 3 or 4 seconds but 10! It's like I would have to call out "Speed!" when out on a shoot.

8 core with 8 GB Ram, 2.5 TB Biggest S2S
OS 10.4.11
FCP 6.0.2

There is some issue with the HDMI output, that might be causing that.

I see your running fcp 6.02, could that be part of the problem?

I just captured 45 minutes yesterday via hdv over firewire
with fcp 6.01 and I have every second of tape captured and just
breaks/new clips where the camera started/stopped.

6.0.2 made no real improvement for me with native capture. I still have to use DVCpro for the odd clips that refuse to come in. its happening a lot less now, but it still happens. its not 100%. I"ve had good luck with maxell tapes as of late when I couldn't get the usuall AMQ's

There is some issue with the HDMI output, that might be causing that.

No issue with HDMI capture- it works fine, captures whole tapes in one clip, which is what I like.

I'm strictly talking firewire here.

So Mark, you are saying you don't lose any source footage at all over firewire? That's amazing. Can you confirm that?

Running FCP 5.1.4, MacBook Pro 2.0 Ghz

Also experienced 7 second gaps between takes, couldn't get FCP to do "capture now" or "batch capture" - kept getting the same message over and over, regarding there being a "data error" and "it could be a problem with the tape."

I have recently upgraded to Leopard, and I suppose automatic updates took me from 5.1.2 to 5.1.4 at some point.

The most incredibly frustrating thing is that using 5.1.2 and Tiger I captured 24P, 25P and 30P flawlessly many many times already.

What the heck happened? Scratching my head. Even DVHScap showed occasional hiccups, though not at the head of every take.

I wonder if Leopard with FCP 6.0.2, improves anything (the most current config possible). I haven't bought Leopard yet because I'm working on deadlines right now.

Anyone try that?

Yeah, anyone try FCP 6.0?

No issue with HDMI capture- it works fine, captures whole tapes in one clip, which is what I like.

I'm strictly talking firewire here.

So Mark, you are saying you don't lose any source footage at all over firewire? That's amazing. Can you confirm that?

I misread your HDMI explanation.

But yes, I consistently capture entire tapes from my HD-50 deck
(still running original firmware) over firewire without any loss of takes.

It does break clips up when the recording was stopped or started
but all HDV cams do that.

When recording though I always warn the shooter to record black
or bars on the first minute or two of tape and to always pre & post roll
each take for at least 10-seconds. Not sure if that affects it.

There is a setting in the capture utility where the audio and video
checkboxes are and audio levels where it says "don't break up clips"
or something to that affect if that helps.

It does break clips up when the recording was stopped or started
but all HDV cams do that.


Canon's A1 (over firewire) does not break clips up at start/stops.

Not sure about Sony.

Canon's A1 (over firewire) does not break clips up at start/stops.

Not sure about Sony.

I've had broken clips from the Canon cams as well as Sony.
EVERY HDV camera does this when capturing over firewire.
When a GOP is broken a new clip is made and breaks the chain.

Thats my experience with HDV over the last 2 years.

To resolve the long gaps during HDV capture that occur at each clip start, you must edit the Easy Set Up to include your own custom Device Control setting.

Change the Pre-roll setting to 1 sec.

This will remove the extra 7 secs of gap when FCPro encounters a break and interprets the pre-roll incorrectly. This WILL leave a 1 sec gap.

Dave

To resolve the long gaps during HDV capture that occur at each clip start, you must edit the Easy Set Up to include your own custom Device Control setting.

Change the Pre-roll setting to 1 sec.

This will remove the extra 7 secs of gap when FCPro encounters a break and interprets the pre-roll incorrectly. This WILL leave a 1 sec gap.

Dave

Thats how I got around that problem as well Dave.

I will give that a try, thanks.

So I went ahead and switched to digitizing 720p60 via firewire (as opposed to HDMI) and yes! Only have 1 sec. gap between takes after changing the device control pre-roll to 1 sec.

NEW PROBLEM!

Any take longer than say 10 minutes or so starts to get broken up into separate clips. This behavior is TOTALLY RANDOM!

I'm using BR-HD50 deck
Brand spanking new JVC Pro HD tape
Fully upgraded HD200 (2 of them)
Fully updated FCP with 10.4.11 OS
8 Core mac with 8GB Ram
La Cie Biggest S2S 2.5 TB RAID

I have officially given up on HDV over firewire and am going back to Intensity over HDMI (which has it's own set of quirks but works well).

NEW PROBLEM!

Any take longer than say 10 minutes or so starts to get broken up into separate clips. This behavior is TOTALLY RANDOM!



being random then I take it the breaks are not occuring where recording was stopped or started.

have you unchecked the option in the capture window (where audio can be checked on or off) that says something about breaking up clips? Thats something to try.

Yeah, tried that. Funny why that option is there. Future use maybe?

Justin,

I am looking at the Intensity Pro option of capturing JVC HDV footage.

What are the quirks you were referring to?

Thanks,

Daniel Weber

Justin,

I am looking at the Intensity Pro option of capturing JVC HDV footage.

What are the quirks you were referring to?

Thanks,

Daniel Weber

The Intensity loses it's signal to all output connections whenever I render while working in ProRes.

It's a major PITA and I've been working with Black Magic to resolve it but to no avail. Even swapped the card out. I think it has to do with my configuration because apparently I'm the only one experiencing this. I've done everything including a complete teardown and rebuild of software and hardware (fresh FCP and OS).

The problem only occurs when working on a ProRes timeline. Everything else works perfect.

We went round and round with JVC about the "random" splits happening with our footage about a year ago - you can search here for those posts. We were shooting lots of timelapse imagery for PBS and it was reeking havoc with our clips. Totally random. I started experimenting with different gear and settings.

The firmware for the cameras, BRHD50 and FCPro upgrades helped a great deal and one of those camera updates was expressly made to address the splits.

OTOH, I accidently discovered that one of our G5's was causing the problem during capture. If I set the destination drive as internal...clips were slip over and over. If I switched it to a firewire 800, no more splits. So the speed of the bus and drive had a lot to do with it. System overhead too.

Now, I rarely have a split clip, but it does happen. Check all your firmware.

Dave B

The Intensity loses it's signal to all output connections whenever I render while working in ProRes.

It's a major PITA and I've been working with Black Magic to resolve it but to no avail. Even swapped the card out. I think it has to do with my configuration because apparently I'm the only one experiencing this. I've done everything including a complete teardown and rebuild of software and hardware (fresh FCP and OS).

The problem only occurs when working on a ProRes timeline. Everything else works perfect.

Since you are using the JVC deck I am guessing that it spits out a native signal via the HDMI?

I am looking at using a Sony HDV deck with HDMI since I have projects that use both the JVC and Sony flavors of HDV. I understand that the Sony decks can play only 720p30 footage. My question is how does the video come out of the HDMI port. Is it 720p30 or 720p59.94?

Do other people using the Intensity have problems with ProRes?

Thanks,

Daniel Weber

No issue with HDMI capture- it works fine, captures whole tapes in one clip, which is what I like.


What do you do for deck control when using HDMI?

HDMI comes out of the deck at 720p60.

I use the RS422 port for deck control.

Justin,

When you work with ProRes is your sequence set up as 720p60 or 720p59.94?

Daniel Weber

Justin,

When you work with ProRes is your sequence set up as 720p60 or 720p59.94?

Daniel Weber

59.94 (I'm not aware of any camera that actually shoots 60.00)