Which is the best editing software for the A1 that handles capture, 24f, and transcoding in and out for DVD creation. EDius, Vegas, Premiere, Avid, or Final Cut? Personal taste or are their true pitfalls to be avoided?

Thanks for your input.

Ralph Bowman

Most of the major editing applications handle Canon F mode now AND have trial versions. Some people like a particular way of doing things, some like the opposite. Take a look through DV/HDV/HD Post-Production...and Beyond (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisplay.php?f=11) forums where you'll find hours of reading on NLE's. Then try a couple of the trials out. They all do the job but they all have bugs. It is entirely a personal decision.

Your decision could be narrowed down significantly by merely picking Mac or PC.

If you are going with a Mac, it seems that Final Cut is very feature rich and obviously optimized for the OS.

If you are going PC, you have more choices but I get the sense that Vegas is winning a lot of people over these days.

I have used Avid, Final Cut and Premiere. I like elements of all of them. I am on a Mac so it was down to Avid and FCP for me. I went with Final Cut. I would have been happy with either. I don't think you will really get 'burned' with any of the top picks.

Quote 'If you are going PC, you have more choices'.

I don't agree. If you look at the major edit applications, you have at least as much choice on a Mac as on a PC:

Mac: Final Cut Express/Studio, Adobe Premiere/Production Suite, Avid Xpress/Media Composer
PC: Sony Vegas, Adobe Premiere/Production Suite, Avid Xpress/Media Composer

I'm using FCP, and it handles 24f fine. I just click on the 1080P24 HDV easy setup and make sure the sequence setting (23.98) matches. No problems at all.

Avid Liquid 7.2 works great with the A1 in all modes.

When I was looking into getting the XH-A1, the only software out there that was compatible with HDV was Final Cut, so I opted for it and a Mac.

I was considering a Matrox system with Premiere, but it didn't do HDV back then.

If this is your first foray into editing, I would go with a Mac and start with Final Cut Express til you learn the jist of things. Diving head first into Final Cut Pro/Studio is a bit of a learning curve, even if you've used other NLE's like Vegas.

When I started editing, it was on 3/4" and VHS. Boy, how the times have changed.

When I was looking into getting the XH-A1, the only software out there that was compatible with HDV was Final Cut, so I opted for it and a Mac.

I was considering a Matrox system with Premiere, but it didn't do HDV back then.

If this is your first foray into editing, I would go with a Mac and start with Final Cut Express til you learn the jist of things. Diving head first into Final Cut Pro/Studio is a bit of a learning curve, even if you've used other NLE's like Vegas.

When I started editing, it was on 3/4" and VHS. Boy, how the times have changed.

The only problem with Final Cut Express is that it can't capture 24f HDV, so that's kind of out of the question.

I personally have and love Final Cut Studio 2. I've used Adobe Premiere 6 before and used the trial version of CS3, and it was okay but I didn't like it as much. But either way, most of the top editing software is very similar and it's all a question of where everything is located.

Avid Liquid 7.2 works great with the A1 in all modes.
Avid Liquid is probably the best-featured HDV editor for the money. It is able to work with the native MPEG footage, so no need to convert to an intermediate codec first (though you can if you wish). It has excellect colour correction and compositing tools built-in, more transitions than anyone could ever wish for, and DVD authoring from the time-line. Some find the user-interface "quirky" but it's very quick and versatile with a little practice. Background rendering and instant saving make your time at the keyboard very productive. It doesn't need any special hardware, but it does need a powerful PC (Core2Duo, 2 GB RAM, 256MB PCI-Express graphics card) and is quite picky about graphics cards and Firewire interfaces (but that's true of all NLEs).

One thing to check very carefully when comparing NLEs is the playback options. Do you have to render your sequence before you can view it at full 1080-line resolution? AFAIK, Canopus Edius working with a Canopus HD card is the only one that can do it without rendering, at the moment. How long does rendering take? What are the low-resolution play-back options? Can you record the finished product back to your camera, and if so, in which modes (the current version of Liquid will record to the XH-A1 in 60i/50i but not in 24F/25F/30F, though it will capture all frame modes).

The best advice is to see a few demos, then download some trial versions (if you have fast Broadband!)

I myself prefer Sony Vegas, I think it's the best compromise for power/ease of use/price.

I didn't like the Premier interface, it looked too crowded and my productivity decreased significantly.
But for each his own, as others have already suggested here, try trial versions and decide for yourself.

One of the great things about the Avid Liquid interface is with a simple right click you can customize most of the menus to add or remove as you like.

I have Vegas 8 and for over a month have been told by Sony that they don't have a fix to allow Version 8 to capture 24f even though Version 7 did. My most recent explanation has been that Sony can't afford to buy a XH-A1 to work out the problem. I myself am looking at Adobe very soon even though I just bought Vegas for the upgrade price. By the way, they recommended that I use HDV Split to capture. I told them that I found it ridiculous to go out of the high priced supposedly all-inclusive software to a free-ware program to perform a function that already worked in a previous version. Go figure. Everyone needs to write Sony and let them know we XH-A1/G1 owners aren't happy.

My most recent explanation has been that Sony can't afford to buy a XH-A1 to work out the problem.

Puhleeeze! :D

btw... it's not nice to double post

I couldn't believe that explanation either Bill. I told them to just revert back to Ver. 7 and whatever they changed...don't!

BTW - I only double posted because I thought this was an important issue for Ralph's original question and the other post is for my sake in hoping that someone has the magic formula I need to make this thing work. It's extremely aggravating with the kind of answers I've been getting from Sony. I hate to pay that much money for a program and have to find a work-around.

I have seen for those using a PC that there is a preference for either Vegas 8 or Avid Liquid 7. The cost factor seems prohibitive for PP 3, and cineform for the int. codec. It also seems to need a high learning curve for use.

Acknowledging personal preference in the formula, for those of us just starting fresh without editing experience, is this a proper summary for a beginner who just wants to create professional video with transitions and music, dubbing wildlife sounds and time lapes?
1. Liquid Avid 7. Able to render, edit with intuitive process.

2. Vegas 8 for 60 i that likewise can render and work without intermediate codec.

Both one and two would be a function of video card and processor?

It seems the general consensus is that Adobe PP 3 is not intuitive and straight forward for beginners, and must be interfaced with Cineform. Both are expensive to purchase, and time consuming to learn? thanks for any input.

I have tried them all.. even got the upgrade to Adobe CS3. The things I don't like about CS3 is one: the video quality in the final render is not very good. Premeire Elements renders better than CS3 I think... and two: the video quality of Adobe Encore's output to SD is poor no matter what I try to do to make it better.

On the other hand, I think the Vegas Suite out performs CS3 in both those areas. Vegas also has some nice filters that CS3 doesn't have.

The bad news though: the latest version of Vegas works horribly on Vista. GRRRRR!

-John

Thanks...i think i have narrowed it down to Vegas 8, but will not upgrade to Vista and stay with XP. What sort of video card etc do you used then with Vegas 8? Any other input?

WBoehm
Bothell, WA

After buying my camera, I was totally out of money and could just use the trial versions of NLE's until they ran out.
In a state of desperation, I tried the following for my editing options:

I should put a tutorial together really.

Dennis,

Transitions must be a bitch! Can you angle cut for a dissolve?!?!?!?! :)

Mike

Sorry for the post, but that was just too funny. I'm still laughing....

I have Vegas 8 and for over a month have been told by Sony that they don't have a fix to allow Version 8 to capture 24f even though Version 7 did. My most recent explanation has been that Sony can't afford to buy a XH-A1 to work out the problem. I myself am looking at Adobe very soon even though I just bought Vegas for the upgrade price. By the way, they recommended that I use HDV Split to capture. I told them that I found it ridiculous to go out of the high priced supposedly all-inclusive software to a free-ware program to perform a function that already worked in a previous version. Go figure. Everyone needs to write Sony and let them know we XH-A1/G1 owners aren't happy.


So can't you just capture in vegas 7 and than open the files in vegas 8? I have both and 6 as well, so isn't that possible?

So can't you just capture in vegas 7 and than open the files in vegas 8? I have both and 6 as well, so isn't that possible?


Yea you can... all it does is take the digital data off the tape on to your harddrive.. i use vegas 7 to capture all the time and then import it into premiere pro or avid from there...

I still havent heard from anyone concerning the usability of Vegas 8 vs Avid Liquid 7, although i think i have narrowed it down to Vegas 8. I will not upgrade to Vista and stay with XP. Any other input? What sort of video card etc do you used then with Vegas 8?

WBoehm
Bothell, WA

I have vegas 6 7 and 8 and run everything from ati 512 cards and nvidia 8800 and 8600 cards, all systems have two cards running two 24"lcd monitors and one 1992x1080 lcd hdtv. The slowest system is a dual dual core amd 5000, the fastest are dual quad core 6600's all have at least 4 gigs on the vista machines and 8 gigs on the xp64 machines. The dual quad running vista with 4 gigs and nvidia is fast the extra ram on a simlar machine running xp64 makes no difference. The nvidia is much faster than ati on the smae machines so in general I would look at nvidia.

Stephen,

That's a great explanation. I have a machine similar to your vista machine and editing HDV on that machine with PPro CS3 is quite fun. I've composited up to 8 HD video layers and can edit/scrub in real time.

Ralph,
Your hard drives are as important as your the rest of your hardware for editing HD video. Ideally you need a RAID configuration that will double (or quadruple) your disk IO. At the end of the day, this is the bottle neck and things will go really slow in most editing software if your disk IO is not fast enough.