David...

Just an FYI...

You may not recall my previous problems with Neo HDV registration. It may be possible that the problem lies not with Cineform or Sony, but, with a registry corruption on some machines.

Bill, I totally agree. I believe Sony is using the registry to determine the existance of the newer CineForm components, and it seems the registry is sometimes incorrect.

My system was having similar problems, but it's all working now (http://dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=103336).
Solution: Re-installed NEO HDV after Vegas Pro 8.

Notes:
For my issues it looks like the Sony Vegas Pro 8 install is the one that's not updating/reading the registry properly.

My system was having the same type of problem, but it's all working now. Fixed it by re-installing NEO HDV after installing Vegas Pro 8.

Notes:
For my issue it looks like the Sony Vegas Pro 8 install is the one that's not updating/reading the registry properly.

Hmm.
This maybe the main fix.

Am I seeing the same issue:
I capture a avi from the HV20 using HDLINK/NEOHD trial version.. I open up the video in vegas 8 trial version, and all I get in the video timeline is solid red.

To solve it, I had to go back into HDLINK prefs and check 'enable smart rendering' and recapture the video.

Then I could see the video on the timeline when I added it in vegas.

Thanks,
Bob C

i'm using neo hdv: "Build 3.0.2.131 14-June-2007" with vegas 8 and it works fine. it opens old projects from v7, and i can read cineform files into new projects. no problems here.

Everyone should update to NEO 3.1.1, which was released yesterday.

David,

Recently I downloaded the demo of VegasPro8 and Neo2K. I was hoping that maybe these new releases would work out the lack of recognizable timecode in the AVIs (doesn't seem to work in .mov files either).

Back in Aug you posted this response to someone else.

"We try not to missing things, but timecode is not supported for historical reasons. AVI has no standard mechanism for storing timecode. If you use our Premiere integrated products (Aspect or Prospect HD) you do get timecode as we created the AVI importer. But outside of Premiere everyone implements timecode differently or not at all."

Timecode support is important to me. If anyone else finds this important please say so - maybe if there is enough interest this can be addressed.

Can this be solved?

Pete

It works in Premiere as Adobe defined an API for timecode, allowing us to implement timecode as we see fit, so if you capture to CineForm within Premiere you get timecode. Vegas however is using VfW, so are separated from the application, with not standard way to communicate timecode (none that I know of.)

Raylight AVIs (created from HVX200 mxf files) seem to contain timecode that Vegas can recognize.

So does that mean perhaps there is a way?

Pete

That's cool, anyone care to do some research to determine where Vegas expects to find timecode. While we have plenty of other engineering projects, it will be one less thing in the way.

Gotta' have timecode as laid down on tape!

Just one vote, but lack of same keeps me away from Cineform for multicam and/or dual system sound. If you follow the recent discussions in the Audio forum, timecode sync is a very hot topic. Many people seem to be using Vegas and liking its robust recognition and sync abilities.

That's cool, anyone care to do some research to determine where Vegas expects to find timecode. While we have plenty of other engineering projects, it will be one less thing in the way.

Dave Hill at Sony can give you the info :) Marcus

Thanks Marcus,

I speak to Dave Hill a lot, I never think to ask on this one.

Great! Thanks Marcus. Thanks David.

Maybe we can get this soon.

Pete

Just bought NEO HDV and noticed that when I render to a Cineform Intermediate AVI in Vegas I have an extra quality setting in the codec settings that HD Link does not have.

HD Link = Low, Medium, High, Film Scan 1, Film Scan 2
Vegas = Low, Medium, High, Higher, Film Scan 1, Film Scan 2

David any info on this?

Thanks,

Marc

Higher is a special version of "High" used for 1920x1080 images that are very detailed -- otherwise it is identical to High. It might go away it future versions as we no longer need this mode (it was before we had Filmscan.)

I have NEO HDV and I don't see a "Higher" in the quality drop down, Am I missing something

Likely looking at a different pulldown, but you are not missing anything.

I have NEO HDV and I don't see a "Higher" in the quality drop down, Am I missing something

Thanks David. Hugh, it's only viewable when configuring the Cineform codec from within Sony Vegas.

Marc

I shot a video in 24F/30F with a Canon XH-A1 and captured it with cineform neo-hdv converted it to 1280*720, with a Medium quality setting, would that be sufficient to do some good color grading in After Effects?

Ernanio, if you're going to be pushing the image quite a bit in post we'd generally recommend you use the High setting, or if you're a quality perfectionist use our Film Scan setting. Each step "up" on quality settings makes larger files by about 10%-15%.

I still have a problem,

I want to add something here RE: V8 crashing, My problem has been when I use Cineform clips (avi) filmscan1 and put them on my timeline, I can save them to a veg. file if I don't render out. I renamed the cfhd.dll. thought it helped until last night. everything was OK until I rendered to a wmv HD file. I did multiple renders on this one veg. file. mpeg2 ntsc was ok, but after the wmv render same problem again, I could get the veg. file to open to 22% then crash, it hangs then all the files open, I click the pop up saying there is problem, crash. Using m2t clips are no problem at all. I tried to get V8 to crash, wouldn't. I can render them into anything and there is no problem. I can go back and put the cineform avi clips back on my timeline, re-do everything and that works, for a while. then crashes again. the computer I am on is a new clean install xp sp2 just for V8, so all programs are newly installed including NEO HDV. are my issues close to anyone else's issues? V7 no issues what so ever. To me, its between V8 and cineform.

Yes, i'm trying to find a balance between space usage and quality for post. I would love to use the "film scan" setting, but if when i convert 200MB m2t to cineform avi in "High" quality setting I get something like double the file size that's hard for me to manage. But I gotta admit, cineform is a lifesaver.

Wow, doesn't sound good, but I'm using Cineform (with Vegas 8) Filmscan avi's and I've rendered into wmv, mpg-2, avi, mp4 without any problems.

It could be my particular computer,but it shouldn't be, the one in question is a laptop, 3.2 gig 1 gig of ram 300 gig ext HD. absolutely no issues with V7 but V8 is a real problem when using cineform NEO HDV, Fresh clean xp install, etc, Off ice computer is a desktop, seems to have issues, yet! I really think its V8 and some quirky issues. Of course I never hear back from Sony,

David: RE:
Yes CineForm components are working fine in Vegas 8. Re-install your CineForm product as it sounds like you simply missing the CineForm VFW codec.
__________________
David Newman
web: www.cineform.com
blog: cineform.blogspot.com

If all software is up to date could I be missing thid codec, I have nothing but problems with V8/cineform NEO HDV

You seem to be the only one now that the Vegas 8 issue has settled. Your errors sound more like Vegas issues, as we have nothing to do with .veg files. In a new project load CineForm AVIs, verify that the codec version is 3.3, not 2.8 within Vegas itself. See if you get the crash with the new project.

Please Give me the steps to verify, and I definitely agree its a vegas 8 issue, 7 was no problem, ano my issue on this computer is still a problem, cannot save cineform avi clips, then open again, thats when 8 crashes for me, If I put new cineform clips on the timeline, edit, render, its ok, its when I try to save them as a veg. file, then re-open it crashes. regular m2t file are not a problem, I did try renaming the cfhd.dll file, didn't seem to help, but I do want to verify the cineform codec if you let me know steps

I found it, should have know all along. cineform codec is 3.3.0 so thats right, all pointing to a vegas flaw, hope its not one of many like window.

I have Neo HDV 3.11 with 3.3 Codec..Found out that avi footage goes on the timeline but when I try to use preview in player I get a need to purchase Cineform HD codec warning box. Granted this is the demo version of Vegas 8 since I am still waiting for my box to arrive from sony. Anyone else notice this? In addition..it took me to reload Cineform after vegas install and also downloaded the neoplayer.

Update:

Just upgraded from Neo HDV to NEO HD..Now Preview to player runs fine with this setting. I am also converting my previous HDV footage to HD 1920x1080 and in Vegas 8 it recognizes it without any hiccups.

Hi David,

Did you have the chance to talk to Dave Hill about this timecode issue? Any progress on this?

Pete

I've been using Cineform Neo HDV to capture footage from Sony V1U and Canon HV20 directly into Cineform avi's and using them in Vegas. I just started using After Effects; If I wanted to export a clip from Vegas and use in AE, can I export as a Cineform avi format to use in AE? Or, given that I have Neo HDV, would I have to export as an m2t file and then import into After Effects

NEO gives you direct CineForm AVI support in After Effects.

Just updated to 8.0a. Did the same thing as before. Luckily re-naming the Sony's CFHD.DLL trick still works. Just thought you should know David.

That is little sad, why didn't Sony fix their bug?

Considering that I, and a few others, made formal inputs to their Tech Support, it would seem they've overlooked this little problem.

I edit weddings. What is Cineform (Neo) and how might it benefit me? I went to their site, but it is still unclear to me what the product is for.

As weddings are less about image enhancement, you may not benefit as much from CineForm. The CineForm products are design with a quality bias, for use in effects and color grading; which is why we particular appeal to the filmmaking crowd.

Thanks David. I am sure my Magic Bullet etc. for use in my highlight clips is sufficient!

The issue for you is rendering of you MB ouptut back to M2T, which is very lossy. This is where CineForm can help. It also depended on your final distrubtion format.

I use the plug in, not the freestanding version...so in my case there are no re-compression issues...

You are always compressing to something. But it you can target your destination format from the Vegas timeline, then you are set.

How to I transfer my neohdv to vegas 8?? Do I need a new license?

If it is not just working (no license transfers or upgrade required) try uninstalling NEO then reinstalling.

I have read through and even after renaming, and even reinstalling the Player, the cfhd.dll file found in Vegas Pro 8 to old i am getting a
"Not licensed for Cineform HD encoding. Please visit...."
It's a new machine with Vista Ultimate 64bit. Any help would be appreciated.

Chuck -

You appear to have Neo Player: Do you have one of the Neo encoding products, e.g. NEO HDV? David can correct me if I'm wrong, but if you only have the player, then that comes only with a viewing codec, not an encoding codec. By renaming the CFHD.DLL that comes with Vegas 8 to "old", you have disabled the only version of the codec on your system that is capable of encoding.

I thought that the discussion in this thread applied to those who have NEO HD or NEO HDV, and not to those with only Neo Player. Again, David can correct if I'm wrong.

You are correct. I only have the cineform (2.5 or 2.8???) that orginally came with Vegas. I was under the impression, and I believe it worked on another workstation, that by simply downloading the player it would update to 3.3. I may have misunderstood that simply getting the player allowed for the 3.3 codec to be used. Dave??
I'm going to work a project or two from start to finsih with the codecs and see if it's worth the purchase. I decided if I'm going to use it at all just the on the fly conversion is worth the price.

I tried one of my other workstations and it WILL render a 3.3 codec AVI from Vegas Pro 8. I believe I did the same thing with renaming the cfhd file. Any other suggestions or maybe it's a Vista 64bit problem on the new computer?

Help