Wow 4 pages about a camera that was announced yesterday and won't be available till december. Rather than try to second guess what this camera will be like why don't we all just wait for an actual review. The a1u is a single chip cmos camera and most people praise it except for low light performance. I think this camera has potential, like most event videographers I would welcome a larger more stable shooting platform that shoulder mount camera provides.
P.S. In reading Sony's release the imply that the image quality is better than the hc7. At least thats how I read it.

Don't think you'll ever see an SD card on a Sony product. Up until they announced Express Card compatibility through SxS for XDCAM EX, their flash memory format of choice has always been their own proprietary Memory Stick, and that's not going to change.
It's already happened - look at http://vaio.sony.co.uk/view/ShowProduct.action?product=VGN-TZ11XN%2FB&site=voe_en_GB_cons&pageType=Overview&category=VN+TZ+Series and scroll down to 'Interfaces'.

Most of the current Sony Vaio range now supports SD cards - this model is fairly typical with slots for SD, ExpressCard and (of course) MemoryStick.

I don't know when the policy changed, I'm only glad it has.

How about that. Guess I shouldn't mention how much I love being proved wrong. Thanks for the clarification -- much appreciated,

Wow 4 pages about a camera that was announced yesterday and won't be available till december.Peter you've been a member here since 2004, and this comes as a surprise to you? Ha!

Rather than try to second guess what this camera will be like why don't we all just wait for an actual review. Because if we didn't second-guess it, then some other internet message board would do it anyway, and probably get most of it wrong.

Looks pretty similar to a Panny Camera...

http://catalog2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ModelDetail?displayTab=O&storeId=11201&catalogId=13051&itemId=98187&catGroupId=14571&surfModel=AG-DVC20

Our school has the older models of these cams.

The following information supplied by Sony to Kevin Cook of the IOV in the UK may be of interest:

The above camcorder was introduced this week at the BIRTV show in China. It is a low cost DV/HDV camcorder targeted for wedding videography and education in developing markets.
We have decided not to promote this product in our region (Europe) as we feel that it does not offer the full functionality that our UK customers require, however, it will be available for sale if a customer deems it suitable and accepts the limitations.

Tentative SRP on the HVR-HD1000E camcorder is £1200.00 and availability is December 07.

For professional users there are the following limitations:

- No DVCAM capability (despite the USA release)
- Mini Jack for Audio
-No Timecode preset
-Mini Cassette only

All out efforts will be put behind the other shoulder mount camcorder with interchangeable lenses which is due in March 08. We will be showing a prototye of this at IBC. Further details of this model will be provided in due course.

---------------

Mike, tahnks for the info. DVCAM deosn't bother me a whole lot. But, as I figured, the unit will not offer XLR inputs for audio. For me that's a deal breaker, end of story.

All out efforts will be put behind the other shoulder mount camcorder with interchangeable lenses which is due in March 08. We will be showing a prototye of this at IBC. Further details of this model will be provided in due course.

Hmmmm.... Does this mean there will be a shoulder mounted Z1U/V1U-esque HDV camera or are they referring to something in the XDCAM line?

Looks like Sony is going after the market that Panasonic's been catering to for a while. I myself have a DVC60, which looks just like this camera, only not HDV, 3 CCDs, and with XLRs on the back. It's a lovely camera, and a lot of the shooters I work with who are used to full-sized ENG cameras really like it, compared to the typical prosumer camera. For me, I was trained to shoot events and sports on Sony DVCAM setups, so I love the design, as it's light, easy to hold, and yet harkens back to the big ENG rigs in many good ways (if only it had a manual lens, then I'd be in heaven!).

Panasonic's coming out soon with an AVCHD shoulder mount camera, that will hopefully be based around the DVC60, so that should be nice, and certainly, if Sony can put together a beautiful lightweight shoulder mount camera with HDV, that'll be a great option too.

Does this mean there will be a shoulder mounted Z1U/V1U-esque HDV camera...?Yes -- see http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showpost.php?p=733044&postcount=26

Does this mean there will be a shoulder mounted Z1U/V1U-esque HDV camera...?See also http://dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=91617

Thanks guys. (And for you forum presence in general, I think I've learned so much just by lurking in these forums.)

Yeah Chris I read that post and Paulo I also saw that camera at the Sony booth at NAB. The guys working the Sony booth told me that the camera's details were still being worked out by the engineers and to take the details advertised with a grain of salt.

The mock up at NAB didn't have the interchangeable lens option. I thought that glass case HDV camera became the HD1000U.

Thanks for clearing it up.

regardless of nitpicking quality, I'm so happy the HD middle ground is finally starting to be established. We've had all the high end cameras, recently the consumer cameras, now we are starting to see the middle ground be established.

Don't think you'll ever see an SD card on a Sony product. Up until they announced Express Card compatibility through SxS for XDCAM EX, their flash memory format of choice has always been their own proprietary Memory Stick, and that's not going to change.
In addition to David's remark, some Sony still cameras also take Compact Flash cards. My DSC F-828 for example - I have a 4GB Hitachi Microdrive spinning in it.

Granted, that some Vaio laptops accept SD cards and other types of flash memory; and that some Sony digicams accept Compact Flash. However, I stand by my assertion that it is highly unlikely that Sony will ever use anything other than Memory Stick or SxS flash memory on their pro, semi-pro or consumer video product line.

Well...if Sony's monitoring the buzz going on on the many video forums, they're probably grabbing all this feedback they're getting. I do agree with the many posters that say that without going to 3 full chips, it's just a "shoulder fired" version of the HVR-A1U. We know they're targeting the wedding/event crowd, but even we want more functionality--and manual control. Sony, keep working...we're watching!!

Out.

I think based on all the discussion -- speculation -- here and elsewhere, it seems that it is indeed a tricked out HC7.

But that doesn't make it a bad cam or even a bad value. The use of the term "pro" in all the press materials notwithstanding, this clearly isn't meant for anyone who has a broadcast destination in mind, but could prove very useful in the wedding, education and corporate areas.

The pros are looking down their noses -- or are they turning them up? -- at this unit because it's too downscale for them. But how many times have you seen wedding videographers scurrying around with their little HC3s? Many shoot with Z1s and Canon H1s as their primary rig, but use the little palmcorders as B-Roll cams, and it doesn't inspire confidence among their clients. And that's nothing to be laughed at when you're around Bridezillas and their very nervous parents who have blown eighty grand on a party. Fair or not, when they see you with the same cam they can pick up at Best Buy, they're thinking, "I'm paying how much for this?"

Or picture the corporate guy who wants to look like a hero for purchasing a "pro" camera at a bargain price in some company A/V unit. He can pick up a couple of these for a song in this age of corporate belt tightening when companies are never willing to pay for the best quality -- just what's good enough to get by.

Or take my situation. I don't make a living at this and probably never will. I mostly do charity and community work as a way of giving back after 25 years in the TV business in LA and NY. Now I shoot a lot of sports videos, first with my VX2000 as my primary (only) cam and now with my FX1 as "A" cam and two HC3s as B and C. Scurrying around with an HC3 and shooting tape of 14-year-old girls from up in the tress -- "honestly, officer, it's the best angle; I'm with the team, I swear!" -- I'm just an obnoxious parent at best and a creepy guy in sweats at worst. But with an HD1000 on my shoulder I'm The Team Videographer.

Perception does matter. Ergonomics matter more. And even if this thing is no better than an HC7, which is no slouch, the form will make it much easier to work with and get stable video while handholding. And note that while it obviously isn't close to the high-end Canons in terms of features, the form factor is actually better -- with the weight of the battery pack and some camera body behind your shoulder, it's more neutrally balanced, leaving your right hand free to point, steady and work controls, not support the weight of the cam, something no shoulder brace (save for the CB-105 I just bought on EBay) can claim.

So I don't think we should sell this one short just yet.

Of course, after it comes out we may discover it to be a piece of junk, and then the derisive snarkiness is appropriate. But for now it's on my radar screen, and I'll be waiting to find out more about it, and potentially a higher end version. Sure, I'd love a V1 with this shape; who wouldn't? But if one of the HC3s croaks -- and maybe even if it doesn't -- I think this baby would come in handy.

I applaud Sony for trying to fill a niche, however small it may be. Certainly nobody else is trying to do so -- not at this price point.

I agree with Adam. Though an FX1 or some other camera would be better, this is a viable option. Better than using the hc3 or hc7, though they are good 2nd cams or B cams themselves for the price.

We should not expect this camera to be feature laden, but it should be usable enough for the task. If we want more, we should dish out U$3,000 or more for a better camera.

True, those who know, will not consider this highly. But the typical consumer doesn't know that. What he sees is a shoulder mount camera that is imposing, especially with the large microphone sticking out. And if this thing can do decently, then it would be a good 2nd cam.

Looking at the photos of the this cam, it looks pretty basic. The controls are few and does the basic stuff. f1.8 lens ranging from 40-400mm 35mm equivalent. The ring is programmable but I bet the way to change it would require you to dig thorough menus.

Well...if Sony's monitoring the buzz going on on the many video forums, they're probably grabbing all this feedback they're getting. I do agree with the many posters that say that without going to 3 full chips, it's just a "shoulder fired" version of the HVR-A1U. We know they're targeting the wedding/event crowd, but even we want more functionality--and manual control. Sony, keep working...we're watching!!

Out.

Well I am happy with it, except I would prefer 720p25/50 at this data rate. If they are listening, they could scrap all this consumer 1080 stuff, and go 720p. I would prefer better codec/data-rate for 1080p25/50 and even more for p50 for professional.

The controls are few and does the basic stuff. f1.8 lens ranging from 40-400mm 35mm equivalent. The ring is programmable but I bet the way to change it would require you to dig thorough menus.

Wow, that's pretty disappointing. While I don't expect XH A1 level controls, something more than a "manual" button would be nice. Thought the lens might be bigger (better low light) but it seems to be the same little lens with nothing but a massive lens hood and a plastic barrel build around it.

Still, it looks good on the tripod, and for certain markets, that's worth a lot in itself. Plenty of room on there to apply a decal for a local cable channel or a business logo. I wonder how much it weighs?

I think it would be nearly identical to the HC7.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=5HmX6GlKCFo

Mmmmm, promotional video. Don't think this has been posted on here yet.

3 1920x1080 global shutter CMOS sensors capturing in H.264 at 100Mbps in 1080p60.

Nice dream. You probably only need one sensor if its big enough. Dream for the Nikon D3 sensor in a video recorder.

I like the wording Sony uses on their UTube promotional: Professional appearance... no claims for actual professional quality.

IMO this camera will satisfy the needs of the majority of wedding videographers.

I didn't know that Sony aquired fischer price. (It doesn't look pro to me at all, more like a cheapo RCA VHS I tossed out a few years ago).

What's with the large storage compartment in the back for? It's gotta be hollow. You can fill it with candy and hang it like a Piñata for the kids after you encouter your first low light situation and give up. :)


I'm kidding. I'm sure Sony knows theres a market for it.

I didn't know that Sony aquired fischer price. (It doesn't look pro to me at all, more like a cheapo RCA VHS I tossed out a few years ago).
Come on, it has professional focus ring.
What's with the large storage compartment in the back for? It's gotta be hollow.
It should be, judging by location of tripod bush. If cameras were designed like machine guns, the back portion of this camera would be a foldable, lightweight carbon-fiber shoulder mount.

And by the way, the comparison between HDV and DV shows DV having 4:3 aspect. Rrrrright.

Looks like it will be coming out in November. Its basicly an hc7 in a bigger case. I definitely like the size and the focus ring. Hopefully it has actual buttons and wheels for exposure wb etc. If the optics are as good as the hc1 then it should be a good camera. I hope its 20x optical zoom like in the bh picture but in the write up it says only 10x optical zoom. On a multi camera shoot you could use the hvr-1000 as the main camera and use the little cousins hc-1 3 5 7 as stationary cameras. Hopefully the price will drop a little after a few months below that $1900.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/518555-REG/Sony_HVRHD1000U_HVR_1000U_1080I_HDV_CAMCORDER.html

Looks like it will be coming out in November. Its basicly an hc7 in a bigger case. I definitely like the size and the focus ring. Hopefully it has actual buttons and wheels for exposure wb etc. If the optics are as good as the hc1 then it should be a good camera. I hope its 20x optical zoom like in the bh picture but in the write up it says only 10x optical zoom. On a multi camera shoot you could use the hvr-1000 as the main camera and use the little cousins hc-1 3 5 7 as stationary cameras. Hopefully the price will drop a little after a few months below that $1900.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/518555-REG/Sony_HVRHD1000U_HVR_1000U_1080I_HDV_CAMCORDER.html



The 20X label near the lens is with the doubler on, so it is a 10X optical zoom. Essentially, it's a HC7 in a more professional package. If the price comes down to say $1500 or $1600, I'll sell my HC7 and get this. I like the picture of the HC7, but I can't get use to the lack of professional controls. Oh, I hope this camera will have manual control of the gain.

It doesn't appear that this camcorder has manual gain control, which is a shame.
Unless it gains up cleanly (with little noise), this could be a problem in a dimly-lit church where additional lighting can't be used. I'd prefer to keep the gain setting low and brighten the image in post.

The product brochure is out on the Sony Broadast & Business Solutions website's HDV product section.

www.sony.com/hdv (redirects to main page)

... and a lot of marketing hype...

... and a lot of marketing hype...
Yeah I have to agree.
There is no mention of any kind of lux rating, and from what I have seen have to agree that the gain is tied into the iris exporure, so that can't be locked.

I could swear that this camera was made by Sony's consumer/prosumer division and not Sony's Pro division.
Looks pretty disappointing for a camera from Sony's Pro division.

We'll have to see what the results are after it's finally released though.

so whats missing? Can it shoot 24P or a variation of it? if you shoot 1080 60i currently is there any difference? I see that is has been said there is no progressive modes but I mainly shoot ether 24f or 1080 60i so if I had to shoot 1080 at 60i is this any different than what I am getting from a canon hdv camera, either the xlh1, xhg1, or even hv20 in terms of file? and is this a true three 1/2 inch chip camera? if so what is the difference in depth of field? how much less? In a good way I woudl like less or the ability to control it more, but from 1/3 to 1/2 is how much of a difference and from 1/2 to a 35mm depth is how much difference?

Chris

Can it shoot 24P or a variation of it?As pointed out at the beginning of this thread, there is no 24fps capability in this camcorder.

I had to shoot 1080 at 60i is this any different than what I am getting from a canon hdv camera, either the xlh1, xhg1, or even hv20 in terms of file?Well, the Canon XL H1 and XH G1 are $9,000 and $7,000 camcorders, respectively. This one is less than $2,000 so I don't think it's a realistic comparison. Basically this is a Sony HC7 in shoulder-mount form, so the Canon HV20 is the only one of the three you mention that would make a fair comparison; even then the most obvious difference (shoulder mount vs. hand held) is the most important consideration.

and is this a true three 1/2 inch chip camera?No; as previously mentioned this camcorder has a single 1/2.9-inch CMOS sensor. For all practical purposes, the sensor size is basically just a hair over 1/3rd-inch. Hope this helps,

BH has street price up of $1600, pushed back to December though. Some added specs up for those interested

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/518555-REG/Sony_HVRHD1000U_HVR_HD1000U_Digital_High_Definition.html

Could this camera be an alternative to the HVR-A1E I've been looking at recently?

Sort of reminds me of the pro hi- 8. ccd-v5000.

That was a serious camera with plenty of manual controls.

From what I have read, this camera basically has the same guts as the consumer HDR-HC7 Handycam, repackaged as a shoulder mount system for wedding videographers who want to look more professional on the job. It will accomplish that and provide somewhat steadier footage, but I wonder about the result. The under $1000 Canon HV-20 is supposed to have a better image. Customers in the wedding market accepted smaller cams years ago.

Sort of reminds me of the pro hi- 8. ccd-v5000.
That was a serious camera with plenty of manual controls.
God, what a great cam that was! I loved my V5000. I had about six of 'em at one point. Perfect ergonomically and beautiful picture for its time.

But objectively, as many controls as the V5000 had, my HC3 has more. And if the HD1000 is just a repackaged HC7, let's wait until we actually see a manual or someone gets his hands on a production model to see what it can do. It obviously has very few controls on the outside but let's see what's available once we dig into the menus.

Just because it isn't as customizable as a V1 or Z1 doesn't necessarily make it less serious.

I think this is a smart move by Sony. It's targeted at the independent shooting weddings and so forth. Many clients equate camera size with quality, so when they see a "big camera" they are reassured.

Now if only Canon would repackage the HV20...

As of Dec. 17, B&H has the HD1000 in stock. $1599.95.

Quick, somebody buy one and check it out.
Then tell the rest of us if we should spend OUR precious money on the HD1000. ;-)

Ken Hull

P.S. -- And let us know what sort of exposure-indication options it has.

Have one on order and will put it thru it's paces after it arrives next week.

Briefly, as I'm off to an all day edit, and back on this evening. Just received a HD1000U from B&H yesterday, loaded it up with a memory card and have taken a few shots at the advertised 6.1 resolution.

As you all would guess, in bright light, takes wonderful stills! Forget everything in limited light, because just like its little brother, the HC7, the noise causes anything dark to be absolutely ugly!

The steadicam works wonderfully (as don't all the Sonys?), and the auto focus is OK. But as you all would guess (and have commented upon), that viewfinder for focus or seeing anything but the grossest detail is totally, absolutely worthless. Sure, you can frame with it (and no, I haven't tested it to see how the viewfinder exhibited framing matches up with reality), but otherwise, that's it.

I use an FX-1 for most of my work, with sometimes use of the HC7 as B-camera in bright light. I see that Sony marketing, when queried about how the CMOS in the HD1000U is the same as the HC7 did their little marketing dance with some blather about how this was really an upgrade - that how it was tweaked by Sony made all the difference! I don't believe a word of it, which is why I haven't even run rudimentary tests on this against the other two HDVs I have - I just assume, until some of you have run some really fine tests, that it is the same as the HC7, except for the form factor.

And I am as happy as I could be with it for the price (and the fine service from B&H) and that form factor - that form factor is precisely why I bought this poor imitation of a shoulder mount! So that in bright venues, where color (and other fidelity) was (were) not prime, I would have something to serve as a nice steady platform, sans a tripod, without wearing one of the always inadequate, awkward harnesses and attachable on shoulder mounts I own. Boy, for that reason, and that reason alone, this camera is just what I wanted.

"that how it was tweaked by Sony made all the difference! I don't believe a word of it,"

I doubt Sony would straight out lie. If they said they tweaked it I am sure they did, but in what way is the question!

well i have one on order and hopefully should have it before the end of the year. I had a chance to see it in Montreal when Sony was doing their show. It looked pretty good. Sure its not a high end prosumer camera, but its under 2 thousand dollars. Ive been working with an HV20 lately and if I can get similar quality out of the 1000u then ill be pleased.

The company I work for got ours on Friday, just starting to play with it now. So far so good.

If it turns out to be a decent unit, Ill pick one up for myself.

Just got a message from the store I ordered mine from. Looks like mine is there now, unfortunately I cant get there today, so Ill pick it up on Wednesday. Definitely looking forward to playing with it.