4:4:4 10bit single CMOS HD project

Steve Nordhauser · June 23rd, 2004, 09:04 PM

Juan,
The motion blur (exposure time) is adjustable from very short to the total frame time (active + vertical blanking) so yes, 1/24th can be programmed.

Xilinx has some free programming tools for smaller designs on their web site. For the record, this is NOT programming even if VHDL or Verilog look like it. This is synchronous hardware design. It requires a different way of thinking. On a clock edge, hundreds of events happen at exactly the same time, propogate and are stable until the next clock edge. Programmers are used to one event happening in time. Even multiple threads are sliced up and happen one at a time. This is not going to be a cakewalk if someone doesn't know hardware design.

Les: Nice test.

Juan M. M. Fiebelkorn · June 23rd, 2004, 09:53 PM

software for JPEG2000 to test:

http://www.ece.uvic.ca/~mdadams/jasper/#software

MIT license model

There is also the libj2k, but I-ve been told it is really slow....

http://www.j2000.org/

So ,Steve, does this mean that if I configure exposure to 1/24 then I could add a mechanical shutter to have 1/48 and eliminate the rolling shutter effect completely?

Rob Lohman · June 24th, 2004, 02:24 AM

Steve: one other thing I was wondering. If we are running at
1280x720 I assumy we are using the middle 720 of 1024? Not
the top or bottom? (since most lenses are sharpest in the middle)

Steve Nordhauser · June 24th, 2004, 06:32 AM

Juan:
I think you are correct. If you open a shutter during the extended vertical blanking period (1/48 sec), close it, all the pixels will expose for the same duration and at the same time. You read out during the other 1/48th and you don't care about the rolling because the shutter is closed. Give the man a cigar - we have a winner. I think this deserves a drum roll also.

Rob L:
Both the size and location of the window is programmable so yes, it can be centered. Much easier to point the camera also. (Pretty funny when you do a 320x240 window on a 3 Mpix sensor, use a wide angle lens and you can't figure out where the image is coming from).

Leads me to another thought. You have more vertical pixels. You could do image stabilization if you record 820 vertical and use the top and bottom 50 rows to debounce the image. It is free once the software is written.

Rob Scott · June 24th, 2004, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Obin Olson wrote:
Rob did you get your camera yet??

Nope, not yet. But family life has been keeping me busy the last few days anyway, so I probably wouldn't have been able to do much.

Obin Olson · June 24th, 2004, 07:28 AM

wow...

http://www.taeym.be/new_page_18.htm

Valeriu Campan · June 24th, 2004, 07:48 AM

wow too...
for more info, see this:
http://www.isgchips.com/Templates/t_quadhdtv.htm

Rob Lohman · June 24th, 2004, 08:07 AM

Unfortunately the price will probably be equally WOW. But it
sure is a neat camera. Why is "Star Wars" printed all over those
boards?

Rob Scott · June 24th, 2004, 08:12 AM

The camera just arrived! Looks like I'll need to get a C mount lens though. Nothing came with it.

Obin Olson · June 24th, 2004, 08:42 AM

hey Rob want me to send U mine? I have to ask the crew here but I maybe could do it! i would send our 75mm OR you can jump on ebay NOW and order one with a buy-it-now and have them ship it fast! they are cheap as dirt on ebay

Rob Scott · June 24th, 2004, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Obin Olson wrote:
hey Rob want me to send U mine?

No, don't send yours. I'll buy one, or perhaps buy an adapter so I can use my 35mm SLR lenses.

Steve Nordhauser · June 24th, 2004, 09:46 AM

Guys, don't strain your "wow" on that camera. JVC had one out using that sensor almost two years ago. We priced it recently. I can't remember but somewhere between $30K and $60K for the sensor in low volumes. Lots of NRE to make up on the camera sales so expect $60K-$100K cameras.

I may go buy 50 12mm used lenses and put one with every single camera sale. Sorry Rob, I thought you were covered. If you want one quick, try a security company that pulls old bank cameras. Most of them were c mount.

Rob Scott · June 24th, 2004, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Steve Nordhauser wrote:
$30K and $60K for the sensor in low volumes

Zoicks! That would be nearly perfect sensor for a HDTV camera, though. I'll bet there will be more like it over the next few years at lower price points.

Quote:

Sorry Rob, I thought you were covered.

No problem. I went ahead and bought one off eBay. I also have a friend (one of the founders of Ipix) who may have a lens I can borrow.

Les Dit · June 24th, 2004, 11:26 AM

The Quad camera was being sold for $60K .
They had a special 8 megapixel LCD display that accepted the 4 DVI inputs for a 'viewfinder'. Like a picture window into reality!

-Les

<<<-- Originally posted by Rob Lohman : Unfortunately the price will probably be equally WOW. But it
sure is a neat camera. Why is "Star Wars" printed all over those
boards? -->>>

Steve Nordhauser · June 24th, 2004, 11:35 AM

Hey, if you can afford the camera, use it with IBM's T221 9.2Mpix 22" LCD monitor. It is only $8.4K so it seems cheap next to the camera. To be fair, I've seen their 3.2Mpix monitor and they are truely awesome.

June 23rd, 2004, 09:04 PM	#406
Steve Nordhauser Silicon Imaging, Inc. Join Date: May 2004 Location: Troy, NY USA Posts: 325	Juan, The motion blur (exposure time) is adjustable from very short to the total frame time (active + vertical blanking) so yes, 1/24th can be programmed. Xilinx has some free programming tools for smaller designs on their web site. For the record, this is NOT programming even if VHDL or Verilog look like it. This is synchronous hardware design. It requires a different way of thinking. On a clock edge, hundreds of events happen at exactly the same time, propogate and are stable until the next clock edge. Programmers are used to one event happening in time. Even multiple threads are sliced up and happen one at a time. This is not going to be a cakewalk if someone doesn't know hardware design. Les: Nice test. __________________ Silicon Imaging, Inc. We see the Light! http://www.siliconimaging.com

June 24th, 2004, 02:24 AM	#408
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	Steve: one other thing I was wondering. If we are running at 1280x720 I assumy we are using the middle 720 of 1024? Not the top or bottom? (since most lenses are sharpest in the middle) __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

June 24th, 2004, 06:32 AM	#409
Steve Nordhauser Silicon Imaging, Inc. Join Date: May 2004 Location: Troy, NY USA Posts: 325	Juan: I think you are correct. If you open a shutter during the extended vertical blanking period (1/48 sec), close it, all the pixels will expose for the same duration and at the same time. You read out during the other 1/48th and you don't care about the rolling because the shutter is closed. Give the man a cigar - we have a winner. I think this deserves a drum roll also. Rob L: Both the size and location of the window is programmable so yes, it can be centered. Much easier to point the camera also. (Pretty funny when you do a 320x240 window on a 3 Mpix sensor, use a wide angle lens and you can't figure out where the image is coming from). Leads me to another thought. You have more vertical pixels. You could do image stabilization if you record 820 vertical and use the top and bottom 50 rows to debounce the image. It is free once the software is written. __________________ Silicon Imaging, Inc. We see the Light! http://www.siliconimaging.com

June 24th, 2004, 08:07 AM	#413
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	Unfortunately the price will probably be equally WOW. But it sure is a neat camera. Why is "Star Wars" printed all over those boards? __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

June 24th, 2004, 08:12 AM	#414
Rob Scott Major Player Join Date: May 2004 Location: Knoxville, TN (USA) Posts: 358	Camera arrived The camera just arrived! Looks like I'll need to get a C mount lens though. Nothing came with it.

June 23rd, 2004, 09:53 PM	#407
Juan M. M. Fiebelkorn Major Player Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Buenos Aires , Argentina Posts: 444	software for JPEG2000 to test: http://www.ece.uvic.ca/~mdadams/jasper/#software MIT license model There is also the libj2k, but I-ve been told it is really slow.... http://www.j2000.org/ So ,Steve, does this mean that if I configure exposure to 1/24 then I could add a mechanical shutter to have 1/48 and eliminate the rolling shutter effect completely?

June 24th, 2004, 07:28 AM	#411
Obin Olson Trustee Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Wilmington NC Posts: 1,414	wow... http://www.taeym.be/new_page_18.htm

June 24th, 2004, 07:48 AM	#412
Valeriu Campan Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 223	wow too... for more info, see this: http://www.isgchips.com/Templates/t_quadhdtv.htm

June 24th, 2004, 08:42 AM	#415
Obin Olson Trustee Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Wilmington NC Posts: 1,414	hey Rob want me to send U mine? I have to ask the crew here but I maybe could do it! i would send our 75mm OR you can jump on ebay NOW and order one with a buy-it-now and have them ship it fast! they are cheap as dirt on ebay

June 24th, 2004, 09:46 AM	#417
Steve Nordhauser Silicon Imaging, Inc. Join Date: May 2004 Location: Troy, NY USA Posts: 325	Guys, don't strain your "wow" on that camera. JVC had one out using that sensor almost two years ago. We priced it recently. I can't remember but somewhere between $30K and $60K for the sensor in low volumes. Lots of NRE to make up on the camera sales so expect $60K-$100K cameras. I may go buy 50 12mm used lenses and put one with every single camera sale. Sorry Rob, I thought you were covered. If you want one quick, try a security company that pulls old bank cameras. Most of them were c mount. __________________ Silicon Imaging, Inc. We see the Light! http://www.siliconimaging.com

June 24th, 2004, 11:26 AM	#419
Les Dit Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Southern Cal-ee-for-Ni-ya Posts: 608	The Quad camera was being sold for $60K . They had a special 8 megapixel LCD display that accepted the 4 DVI inputs for a 'viewfinder'. Like a picture window into reality! -Les <<<-- Originally posted by Rob Lohman : Unfortunately the price will probably be equally WOW. But it sure is a neat camera. Why is "Star Wars" printed all over those boards? -->>>

June 24th, 2004, 11:35 AM	#420
Steve Nordhauser Silicon Imaging, Inc. Join Date: May 2004 Location: Troy, NY USA Posts: 325	Hey, if you can afford the camera, use it with IBM's T221 9.2Mpix 22" LCD monitor. It is only $8.4K so it seems cheap next to the camera. To be fair, I've seen their 3.2Mpix monitor and they are truely awesome. __________________ Silicon Imaging, Inc. We see the Light! http://www.siliconimaging.com