The new H4n recorder
 

I just recieved the new recorder and used it on one wedding. I can't speak to the technical side, although I can say the recording results are very good to my ears, there are a two things I am a little disappointed with.

1) The rubberized body is just a coating of sorts. It looks rubberized, but does not feel that way. Just my opinion.

2) The recorder does not (at least I have not yet discovered it) allow for separate recording levels within the two tracks of the on-board mike or the imputs.

Bill, thanks for the report - I wasn't aware that the H4n was shipping.

Right - I don't think the H4 allows different recording levels for each of the XLR inputs, and I don't really need it or want it for the built-in mics. But that would be nice to have on the XLRs...

H4n
 

In the MTR (multi-track recording) mode, each channel is separately adjustable: Page 42. Also, be sure to go to ZOOM and get the firmware update.

I haven't put the H4n to any difficult yasks yet, but it seems promising.

Chris

I know that in MTR each channel is adjustable, but I couldn't figure out how to start recording on all 4 channels at the same time.

for more info about this recorder

H4n Handy Recorder

So, if I'm using just the inputs, say a wireless mic on one, and a shotgun mic on the other, I can't control the levels on these seperatly? What I do to one I have to do to both?

Unless I'm in 4 track mode, which means only 16 bit, not 24bit, then I can do whatever to each track independently?

Anybody who has the new H4n - several of us would send very good thoughts your way if you would be so kind as to do a one-hour sync test.

E.g., run your camcorder, run the H4n at 16/48 or 24/48, audible slate, roll both for an hour, tail-slate, ingest to your editing system, and see how the marks line up in your NLE.

The original H4's clock wasn't good enough for long takes... Sure hope Zoom improved on the clock chip.

Dylan - I am still learning this H4n and so far, I have not been able to adjust the inputs individually AND record both channels at the same time.

I'll try to get a sync test done asap.

On the original H4 (firmware 2.20) you could separately adjust the recording levels of the two external inputs. It is in a menu however, you couldn't easily do it "live". It's more for fine tweaking in addition to the gross adjustment of the two external sensitivity switches. I feed mine with a mixer almost 100% of the time, so again it's just a fine tweak to match the output of the mixer. The few times I used just external mics hooked directly to the H4 I also adjusted these levels independently, but the material I was recording was pretty even.

Surely they didn't do away with this control on the new unit!?

I have been working with the H4n and unfortunately, it appears to me, that they have removed the track adjustment feature.

I just completed a sync test with my camera and the H4n, and after one hour of record time there is NO noticable difference to the ear. Looking at the timeline waveform the H4n appears to be slower by one or two frames.

Does this recorder work for voice overs? I was looking at a ROPE podcaster but the Zoom H4n attrached me.

Sean, it records audio very well.

Interesting. How are the preamps?

I cannot comment on the technical side. I just know the sync is quite accurate and the audio sounds very good.

Anyone else?

Manual
 

Is here:

http://www.zoom.co.jp/archive/English_Manual/E_H4n.pdf

Others:

Download Manual

This looks like it could be a very useful little recorder. Zoom seems to have listened to their users and outdone themselves on this one.

I wish they had schematic or at least a block diagram. I am trying to figure out if I might be able to plug in an actually useful mic to that tiny, apparently stereo mini jack that has a 2k unbalanced input. Maybe with a transformer...

Apparently you're mistaken... page 59 in the pdf manual, unless this is something different.

*edit* WAIT! What's MTR? :-\ more reading to do

Bill Busby - I could be wrong, but it appears to me that not all four tracks can be recorded at once with each track having an independent volume control adjustment.

Anyone else who has one of these recorders? Chime in.

Also, when H4n is set to auto level it will lower input levels according to the highest sound recorded. In other words, if there is a loud clap or if the recorder mic is bumped directly while recording or standby it will lower the input/sensitivity for the rest of that particular recording. It is not like a camera on auto level where the sensitivity will go back to normal levels after a loud noise.

Bill, thanks for that report. 2 frames over an hour (if that) means it's not a high-end recorder, but I think that's quite acceptable at the price point.

In fact, if you're not hearing echo between the tracks after an hour, it's probably better than two frames accuracy.

Much appreciated, thanks for running that test!

While I haven't tried it yet, the manual appears to state that in 4 channel mode you can record from the onboard mics and the inputs with separate levels for each set of inputs. It also seems to say that in MTR mode you can set separate levels for each of the 4 tracks (see page 56). So, two stereo inputs in 4 channel mode and 4 mono inputs (or combinations of the two sets of inputs) in MTR mode. Problem is the manual is not written clearly but I will report back when I have the opportunity to try this out. John.

John - check out page 137. It looks like 4 channels can be recorded simultaneously but the "(Stereo 2 tracks)" means it cannot record 4 tracks while in stereo? Or does it mean you can record 4 tracks, but it must be IN stereo mode? Meaning you can adjust sensitivity for internal mics and the inputs together.

It might be useful to remember that this test has shown that this particular example of this new recorder is pretty much in sync with this particular camera.
Even if the recorder was absolutely spot on, and the camera 'clock' was slightly adrift, it would still be necessary to adjust the length of the 'correct' recorder audio track to match the incorrect camera one. After all, it's the camera audio that will be in sync with the video, and has to remain the master track -even if it's wrong!

Some of the cheaper audio recorders can require quite a significant amount of resyncing, especially on longer takes, and it sounds as if Zoom have tightened up on their crystal oscillator specs with the new unit -excellent news.

But if your camera is slightly out (and they too only use commercial crystals), it stiil might mean some work in post!!

For those who may not have seen this yet.

YouTube - Zoom H4N digital audio recorder

Hi Bill. I had time to muck around with it a bit this afternoon. To answer your questions, 4 channels can be recorded separately in 4 channel mode but only as 2 distinct stereo sources. In other words, you can set an input level for the onboard mics and a separate input level for the other two inputs. Just plug in your mic, ensure phantom is on and use the "mic" "1" "2" buttons on the left front to choose the input and adjust its level. Not explained well in the manual (see below for more on that) but not too hard to figure out by pressing buttons.

Stereo recording mode is only for stereo but there is a built in MS matrix so you could record MS and have the box decode it for you, nice feature.

In addition, in MTR mode it appears you can record in stereo with the onboard mics and use the inputs as separate mono sources but it would be fiddly. It seems you have to start with a "project" to make MTR mode work properly. You then would have to record one mono track or your stereo track and then track alongside the already recorded track. I think they've attempted to set this mode up for overdubs but I'd never use this in my world, would be nice if they would upgrade it so you could set levels for all 4 tracks independently but that might be asking a lot for such a cost effective package. I didn't actually record anything so I can't speak to the mic pre's but I will report back as soon as I do.

As far as clock goes, no one should be using this for a sync recorder, it's not designed for that and you will be sorely disappointed at some point down the road. Do a search for "sync" or "drift", plenty has been written here recently regarding recorders and sync.

On another note to anyone who is considering this recorder, this has to be one of the worst manuals I have ever had the displeasure of attempting to decipher. The Zoom H2 manual is written better. This one appears to have been written by someone in a Zoom foreign office who believes their English is perfect...either that or they used Google translator, it's that bad. John.

I use these for wedding speakers and singers. My sync is usually only5 to 15 minutes long it works perfectly for me.

Bill how does the H4n handle loud spl levels.
I see that the H4n doesn't have switchable Gain pads (L/M/H), like the H2 does. So I was wondering how improved the onboard pres are at handling loud spl levels like micing a PA stack at a wedding reception. I wanted to use the H4n in this manner,

—Attached (clamped) H4n to mic stand facing away from PA stack towards crowd.
—Use a pair of Rode M3 condenser mics with the internal -25db pad switched on plugged into each XLR port with one recording the PA tweeter and one recording the PA woofer. —Then face out the H4n and use the onboard mics to record crowd reaction.

I ask because the H2 handles loud spl levels horribly, unless you turn the onboard gain to L (low). And even that is iffy at a reception where I am miking the PA,s. the audio then either gets muddy, where teh highs are cut down considerably, or the audio can still clip, with that annoying unrepairable electronic chirping sound.

I used to own the H4 a few years ago but don't remember how they handled loud spl levels, I vaguely remember them handling them better.

I have not used the inputs with mics to record audio, but I have used the onboard mics to record from a loud DJ speaker (sitting ontop the speaker) at a reception and it recorded good audio with the one time adjustment I made at the beginning of the reception. I checked the VU meters on the recorder about 5 or 6 different times and never had to adjust sensitivity.

I have used the XLR inputs with the output of a sound board. Again, set the sensitivity and let it go. Part of the audio was 'out of bounds' (I'm not an audio guy) on the waveform, but it is still very useable. Only needed to lower the volume slightly.

I am very happy with the recorder with the exception of being able to adjust each track independently. As it turns out, I don' t seem to need that feature.

Zoom H4n or Marantz PMD661?
 

I'm in the market for a recorder and I've been reading good things about both of these. The Zoom is quite a bit cheaper but I heard a sample of the Marantz and it sounded better than the Zoom sample -- which may have been due to any number of variables other than the recorder itself, of course. But samples are tough to find.

For the (probably) small number of people who know both, which would you recommend?

I do indie filmmaking and corporate videos and dialog ends up as the majority of my audio.

In my opinion, the H4n does a very good job for most of my applications which is weddings so far.

Bill, so do you think the H4N has more than $150 worth of improvement over the H4?

I would rather have the H4n than the H4 in my tool bag. The screen and fonts are bigger, the menu is much more intuitive, and I can record from onboard mics and inputs as the same time.

I sold my H4 and then bought the H4n and have no real regrets. Although, if there were one thing I could change, I would want each of the 4 tracks to be individually adjustable for record volume.

Is it $150 worth of improvement over the H4? That is a subjective question and my answer is yes.

And when is B&H going to start carrying these? I've been holding out from buying from Amazon.... what's the hold up?

Good question....I was holding out for B&H but couldn't hold out any longer...needed a recorder for an upcoming wedding so I bought one from a store on EBAY. Came with 16 gig SDHC for the same price as B & H. Also, do a google search to find companies selling this recorder.

Yeah, I don't know... I've got some serious OCD issues when it comes to "what happens when I break it in 3 months??" thoughts that prevent me from buying Ebay/random .com stores. Plus I've got some other goodies from B&H I'd like to pack into my mandatory $50 shipping fee.

But I need get audio away from my camera and start practicing recording double system sooner than later... grrrr. *throws an angry colbert fist into the air* B&H!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The 'dealer' I bought from is a store in Florida that says they are an authorized Zoom seller, so warranty is in force and shipping was free.

Zoom H4n: lovers and haters
 

Bill,

I've been trying to read as much as I can about the Zoom H4n on the web. There's not much and very few samples. Brad Linder's blog has both excellent (quiet) and awful (hissy) samples, which led to an extended flame war in the comments section there:

Brad Linder's blog: Zoom H4n audio take 2 - second time not so charming

You seem to really like the recorder. Have you experienced the hiss on your H4n? Especially with external mics? Linder says he'll publish a full review later, including a test of the external mics, but it may not be for a week or more. I'm no audiophile, but except for the Neil Ewers samples on this Linder blog, which do sound bad, the H4n sees to be a great deal. What's your take?

I am not an 'audiophile' either, and I cannot attest to the use of a mic attached to the H4n. I've only used the inputs from a sound board and the onboard mics for weddings. I'm totally happy with it.

I'm wondering if I'm going to lose any sound quality if I use an H4n to record from an SD302.

B&H accepting orders now.

I guess whichever recorder I choose would be better than feeding audio to camera/tape... right?