Using the nanoFlash for software tutorials at DVinfo.net

Adam Stanislav · February 11th, 2010, 01:16 AM

I am wondering if it is possible to produce software tutorials with the nanoFlash. Specifically, the computer has a DVI video output. So, would using a DVI to HDMI adapter and setting the screen refresh rate to 24 Hz (or 30 Hz) and its resolution to 1920x1080 make it possible to record the video output with a nanoFlash?

I know there are other ways of grabbing screen output directly on the computer, but I would like to know if this would work. And if so, has anyone done it?

Dan Keaton · February 11th, 2010, 08:43 AM

Dear Adam,

Yes, this may work, but it is not guaranteed.

One needs to feed the nanoFlash a clean HDMI signal, with one of the standard frame rates and one of the standard resolutions, 1920 x 1080 or 1280 x 720.

We know that the Nvidia Quadro FX 4600 can not be used with the nanoFlash. The frame rate/frequency of the output is not within spec.

We know that other graphics cards do work.
(But, I do not have a list of what works and does not work).

Adam Stanislav · February 11th, 2010, 09:48 AM

Thanks, Dan. How about GeForce 6200 TurboCache? Would that one work?

Dan Keaton · February 11th, 2010, 10:54 AM

Dear Adam,

We have not tested that graphics card with the nanoFlash.

One of the problems is that there are hundreds, if not thousands of graphics cards.

Also, we can not tell by reading the spec's.

In certain cases, we can tell if a card will not work by reading the spec's, but it has to be tested to determine if it actually works or not.

Also, generally the spec's do not include the information we need to determine if the card will work or not.

So, to be as helpful as possible:

We need to be able to record in standard video formats, in standard video frame rates.

In other words, it has to look like video for us to record it. For example, a resolution of 1600 x 1200 is not acceptable.

I have read the spec's on this card. If you can select 1920 x 1080 at 23.976, 23.98, 24, 29.97, or 30 frames a second, then we may be able to record from your card.

Rafael Amador · February 11th, 2010, 11:10 AM

The video card needs to detect a monitor; then will output according with that.
You can pass the signal through an HD TV and record with the NANO the HDMI OUT of the TV.
That one should be standard.
May work.
Rafael

Adam Stanislav · February 11th, 2010, 12:55 PM

Thanks, both of you. I am hoping the card will detect the nanoFlash and assume it is a monitor. Though I could always pass the signal from the nF to my smallHD monitor, which can accept HDMI signal. Indeed, I would have to, otherwise I would not see what I was doing.

I also have a Sony Vaio laptop which has an HDMI port and I have successfully connected the smallHD to it. But I would rather use my desktop. Nevertheless, if I have to, I can use the laptop.

Thanks again,
Adam

PS, I just checked. The card does support 1920x1080 but the lowest refresh rate it goes to is 60 Hz, which I assume is comparable to 60 frames per second, not 30 frames per second.

I will have to see if there is some kind of DVI to HDMI converter that can turn it to 30 fps.

Aaron Newsome · February 11th, 2010, 02:08 PM

I've done extensive testing of capturing computer output. This is something that is highly dependent on the video card. Also, be aware that many video cards will be limited to the refresh rate (frame rate).

I'll say it does work pretty well from what I've tried but I'm mostly using a laptop with an analog video output, converting that to a digital signal that can be recorded by the XDR.

I know there is one guy on the forums here, who captures XBOX 360 output via HDMI. I'm sure he's went through a lot of the same trial and error discovery that I have.

It's working pretty well for me though, my biggest issue is that the XDR/nano can't record true 60i in Quicktime format. This however, is addressed in the next version of the firmware update. Can't wait to try it out.

Dan Keaton · February 11th, 2010, 02:33 PM

Dear Rafael,

In order for the nanoFlash to work, we have to negotiate with the sending device, via the HDMI link.

We do this.

There is no necessity to have a monitor in between us and the sending device.

XBOX 360 can not normally be recorded via the nanoFlash, as the "Broadcast Flag" is set, indicating that the signal is copy protected, thus the nanoFlash can not record it.

The company that is recording the XBOX 360 is a game developer. As such, they have a special developmental system, where the "Broadcast Flag" is not set.

Adam Stanislav · February 11th, 2010, 03:55 PM

Does this negotiation work when your computer has a DVI output and you put a $10 DVI->HDMI adapter in-between?

Dan Keaton · February 11th, 2010, 04:01 PM

Dear Adam,

Yes, it should.

This is if your DVI graphic card supports HDCP.

Aaron Newsome · February 11th, 2010, 04:10 PM

Adam, I have done recordings with DVI->HDMI cable. Also, the DVI->HDMI cable is a simple wiring adapter, not a converter since the signaling is the same.

Again, though, your video card needs to put out a signal on the DVI port that the nano will be able to sync to.

Adam Stanislav · February 11th, 2010, 06:35 PM

Since PowerDVD refuses to play Blu-ray on that computer, I do not think my card supports HDCP, but compared to the cost of the nF, a new card would be peanuts. So, I have just called B&H and ordered the nF. I will have to call them back tomorrow to arrange for the payments, but it is a done deal now.

They do not have it in stock but say they will have it within a week or two.

Of course, my main use will be with my Sony EX-3 anyway, but I am glad to see it can also be used to record the output of the video of the computer.

Dan Keaton · February 11th, 2010, 06:56 PM

Dear Adam,

Welcome Aboard!

Please feel free to contact me at anytime for support or assistance.

Rafael Amador · February 11th, 2010, 07:10 PM

The point to force the DVI to output an standard signal, and any certified video card should do it when detecting an HD, PAL or NTSC monitor.
Then the NANO should be able to record that signal.
Rafael

Adam Stanislav · February 11th, 2010, 07:54 PM

Thanks, Dan. I'm sure I'll have more questions once I have received it.

February 11th, 2010, 01:16 AM	#1
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Using the nanoFlash for software tutorials I am wondering if it is possible to produce software tutorials with the nanoFlash. Specifically, the computer has a DVI video output. So, would using a DVI to HDMI adapter and setting the screen refresh rate to 24 Hz (or 30 Hz) and its resolution to 1920x1080 make it possible to record the video output with a nanoFlash? I know there are other ways of grabbing screen output directly on the computer, but I would like to know if this would work. And if so, has anyone done it?

February 11th, 2010, 08:43 AM	#2
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Adam, Yes, this may work, but it is not guaranteed. One needs to feed the nanoFlash a clean HDMI signal, with one of the standard frame rates and one of the standard resolutions, 1920 x 1080 or 1280 x 720. We know that the Nvidia Quadro FX 4600 can not be used with the nanoFlash. The frame rate/frequency of the output is not within spec. We know that other graphics cards do work. (But, I do not have a list of what works and does not work). __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 11th, 2010, 10:54 AM	#4
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Adam, We have not tested that graphics card with the nanoFlash. One of the problems is that there are hundreds, if not thousands of graphics cards. Also, we can not tell by reading the spec's. In certain cases, we can tell if a card will not work by reading the spec's, but it has to be tested to determine if it actually works or not. Also, generally the spec's do not include the information we need to determine if the card will work or not. So, to be as helpful as possible: We need to be able to record in standard video formats, in standard video frame rates. In other words, it has to look like video for us to record it. For example, a resolution of 1600 x 1200 is not acceptable. I have read the spec's on this card. If you can select 1920 x 1080 at 23.976, 23.98, 24, 29.97, or 30 frames a second, then we may be able to record from your card. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 11th, 2010, 02:33 PM	#8
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Rafael, In order for the nanoFlash to work, we have to negotiate with the sending device, via the HDMI link. We do this. There is no necessity to have a monitor in between us and the sending device. XBOX 360 can not normally be recorded via the nanoFlash, as the "Broadcast Flag" is set, indicating that the signal is copy protected, thus the nanoFlash can not record it. The company that is recording the XBOX 360 is a game developer. As such, they have a special developmental system, where the "Broadcast Flag" is not set. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 11th, 2010, 04:01 PM	#10
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Adam, Yes, it should. This is if your DVI graphic card supports HDCP. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 11th, 2010, 09:48 AM	#3
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Thanks, Dan. How about GeForce 6200 TurboCache? Would that one work?

February 11th, 2010, 11:10 AM	#5
Rafael Amador Major Player Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Vientiane (Lao PDR) Posts: 349	The video card needs to detect a monitor; then will output according with that. You can pass the signal through an HD TV and record with the NANO the HDMI OUT of the TV. That one should be standard. May work. Rafael

February 11th, 2010, 12:55 PM	#6
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Thanks, both of you. I am hoping the card will detect the nanoFlash and assume it is a monitor. Though I could always pass the signal from the nF to my smallHD monitor, which can accept HDMI signal. Indeed, I would have to, otherwise I would not see what I was doing. I also have a Sony Vaio laptop which has an HDMI port and I have successfully connected the smallHD to it. But I would rather use my desktop. Nevertheless, if I have to, I can use the laptop. Thanks again, Adam PS, I just checked. The card does support 1920x1080 but the lowest refresh rate it goes to is 60 Hz, which I assume is comparable to 60 frames per second, not 30 frames per second. I will have to see if there is some kind of DVI to HDMI converter that can turn it to 30 fps.

February 11th, 2010, 02:08 PM	#7
Aaron Newsome Major Player Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Rancho Santa Margarita Posts: 590	I've done extensive testing of capturing computer output. This is something that is highly dependent on the video card. Also, be aware that many video cards will be limited to the refresh rate (frame rate). I'll say it does work pretty well from what I've tried but I'm mostly using a laptop with an analog video output, converting that to a digital signal that can be recorded by the XDR. I know there is one guy on the forums here, who captures XBOX 360 output via HDMI. I'm sure he's went through a lot of the same trial and error discovery that I have. It's working pretty well for me though, my biggest issue is that the XDR/nano can't record true 60i in Quicktime format. This however, is addressed in the next version of the firmware update. Can't wait to try it out.

February 11th, 2010, 03:55 PM	#9
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Does this negotiation work when your computer has a DVI output and you put a $10 DVI->HDMI adapter in-between?

February 11th, 2010, 04:10 PM	#11
Aaron Newsome Major Player Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Rancho Santa Margarita Posts: 590	Adam, I have done recordings with DVI->HDMI cable. Also, the DVI->HDMI cable is a simple wiring adapter, not a converter since the signaling is the same. Again, though, your video card needs to put out a signal on the DVI port that the nano will be able to sync to.

February 11th, 2010, 06:35 PM	#12
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Since PowerDVD refuses to play Blu-ray on that computer, I do not think my card supports HDCP, but compared to the cost of the nF, a new card would be peanuts. So, I have just called B&H and ordered the nF. I will have to call them back tomorrow to arrange for the payments, but it is a done deal now. They do not have it in stock but say they will have it within a week or two. Of course, my main use will be with my Sony EX-3 anyway, but I am glad to see it can also be used to record the output of the video of the computer.

February 11th, 2010, 06:56 PM	#13
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Adam, Welcome Aboard! Please feel free to contact me at anytime for support or assistance. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

February 11th, 2010, 07:10 PM	#14
Rafael Amador Major Player Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Vientiane (Lao PDR) Posts: 349	The point to force the DVI to output an standard signal, and any certified video card should do it when detecting an HD, PAL or NTSC monitor. Then the NANO should be able to record that signal. Rafael

February 11th, 2010, 07:54 PM	#15
Adam Stanislav Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Rhinelander, WI Posts: 1,258	Thanks, Dan. I'm sure I'll have more questions once I have received it.