Sennheiser ME66/K6 vs Azden SGM-1X sound clips at DVinfo.net

Jeff Toogood · July 15th, 2004, 06:00 PM

I just got my Sennheiser ME66/K6 today and I thought I would do a quick comparison between the two mics. The Sennheiser easily destroys the Azden SGM-1X.

Both mics were going through a Canon MA-300 XLR adapter and into a Canon GL2 with audio set to manual mode.

Sennheiser ME66/K6
http://www.digitaliso.ca/ME66.mp3

Azden SGM-1X
http://www.digitaliso.ca/sgm1x.mp3

Pretty un-scientific test, but it does show the difference.

Matt Gettemeier · July 15th, 2004, 11:59 PM

Thanks for posting that Jeff!

I wish EVERYBODY did stuff like this... About a year and a half ago I wondered why there could be SO many different mic selections at every price-point and in every class. It seems like there should just be an obvious choice to fill whatever need a person has...

In this case it's clear that the Sennheiser is the winner and your clip also answers questions about the differences between that mic and that model of Azden.

Thanks again for going to the trouble to share that.

Dave Largent · July 16th, 2004, 03:56 PM

I'd be interested to hear what your test here is designed
to show. Sensitivity? Sound quality? If it's the quality,
you'd get a more fair comparison by equalizing the recorded
volumes of the two mics. As it is, the Senn is recorded at
2 1/2 times the level of the Azden, and it's known that
persons will often pick the louder one as *better*, just
because it's louder.

Jeff Toogood · July 16th, 2004, 05:22 PM

Like I said, it wasn't a scientific test. I basically just wanted to demonstrate what both mics sounded like set to exactly the same settings on the camera.

It is true that louder doesn't always mean better, but with the Azden I couldn't even use the audio. So to me the Sennheiser is MUCH more useful.

David Ennis · July 18th, 2004, 07:21 PM

Jeff, I mentioned this thread in my post, "Okay, Physics enthusiats..."

If it's true, as I assume, that the MA300 has an imput impedance of 200 ohms, then the SGM might sound better (i.e., louder) if you didn't use the MA300. Do you have an adaptor cable?

--
Fred

Jeff Toogood · July 18th, 2004, 08:18 PM

Check out this other thread I posted

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=28673

I think you may be on to something

Glenn Chan · July 18th, 2004, 08:22 PM

Both sound crappy indoors IMO, but that's because shotgun mics don't do very well indoors. The echo/reverb makes the sound hollow and artificial to my eyes.

As far as the two mics go, the Azden sounds "warmer". I tried making the Sennheiser sound warmer like the Azden. In Vegas, you can get a lot closer by putting the Smooth/Enhance filter on and setting it to smooth 2 notches (5 notches either way is the max). If you look at the waveforms of both mics, the Sennheiser is noticeably more detailed (after normalization).

The Azden sounds like it has distortion on certain words. I'm not sure if I'm interpreting that right.

If you didn't get to process the sound in post, I would like the Azden a little better because it sounds warm/nice compared to the hollow/realistic/artificial sound of the ME66. If the mic was used for real projects, the ME66 would likely be better depending on what kind of sound you want. If you are looking for "warm-sounding" voice then you'd be looking at something other than a shotgun.

Anyways, thanks for the comparison! I would find it useful if buying a shotgun mic.

2- I was listening to the sound on my pair of AKG66 headphones (AKG66 review: they're headphones). The shotguns sound better when panned to just one ear. I don't like the weird reverb when the sound is panned center.

David Ennis · July 18th, 2004, 09:04 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Jeff Toogood : Check out this other thread I posted

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=28673

I think you may be on to something -->>>

Might be. I just wish Canon would publish specs on their accessories so we'd have a shot at making better decisions.

Bryan Beasleigh · July 18th, 2004, 10:40 PM

The Azden has a sensitivety of -41db @ 1 pa the Sennheiser is
-25 db @1pa (10mvvs 50 mv). That means the sennheiser is more than 2.5 times hotter, hence the difference in volume. Bottom line is the Azden isn't a pro gear, the sennheiser is quieter, hotter and has more dynamic range.

Jay Massengill · July 19th, 2004, 06:58 AM

I'd also say that when making a comparison test you should set each mic to get their optimum performance. While it is important to understand which mics are more sensitive than others, simply setting both mics to the same arbitrary number on your input controls doesn't really tell you what each can accomplish.
If you only had the one mic, you wouldn't arbitrarily set your controls, you'd adjust them for best performance with the equipment you had. Do the same when making a comparison recording. If the difference in sensitivity is so wide that there's still a noticeable change in the volume levels of the camera recording, then it is helpful to make them equivalent later. Just keep in mind the extra step that was needed for the weaker source if you were doing this for real and also carefully listen for the additional noise that this step may add.
Have your mics positioned and supported as similarly as possible, without getting them so close to each other that they begin to physically alter each other's sound. Record simultaneous split tracks of the same sound source.
Put the clips on your NLE, center them, make their volume equal, then cut them together so there's no gap when switching from one to the other. Listen carefully as your NLE plays back the whole sequence and even subtle differences start to be more easily recognized.

July 15th, 2004, 06:00 PM	#1
Jeff Toogood Major Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: St.Thomas, Ontario, CANADA Posts: 428	Sennheiser ME66/K6 vs Azden SGM-1X sound clips I just got my Sennheiser ME66/K6 today and I thought I would do a quick comparison between the two mics. The Sennheiser easily destroys the Azden SGM-1X. Both mics were going through a Canon MA-300 XLR adapter and into a Canon GL2 with audio set to manual mode. Sennheiser ME66/K6 http://www.digitaliso.ca/ME66.mp3 Azden SGM-1X http://www.digitaliso.ca/sgm1x.mp3 Pretty un-scientific test, but it does show the difference. __________________ Toogood Studios

July 16th, 2004, 05:22 PM	#4
Jeff Toogood Major Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: St.Thomas, Ontario, CANADA Posts: 428	Like I said, it wasn't a scientific test. I basically just wanted to demonstrate what both mics sounded like set to exactly the same settings on the camera. It is true that louder doesn't always mean better, but with the Azden I couldn't even use the audio. So to me the Sennheiser is MUCH more useful. __________________ Toogood Studios

July 18th, 2004, 07:21 PM	#5
David Ennis Fred Retread Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Hartford, CT Posts: 1,227	XLR to minijack cable for the SGM-1X? Jeff, I mentioned this thread in my post, "Okay, Physics enthusiats..." If it's true, as I assume, that the MA300 has an imput impedance of 200 ohms, then the SGM might sound better (i.e., louder) if you didn't use the MA300. Do you have an adaptor cable? -- Fred __________________ "Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence..." - Calvin Coolidge "My brain is wired to want to know how other things are wired." - Me

July 18th, 2004, 08:18 PM	#6
Jeff Toogood Major Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: St.Thomas, Ontario, CANADA Posts: 428	Check out this other thread I posted http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=28673 I think you may be on to something __________________ Toogood Studios

July 18th, 2004, 09:04 PM	#8
David Ennis Fred Retread Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Hartford, CT Posts: 1,227	<<<-- Originally posted by Jeff Toogood : Check out this other thread I posted http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=28673 I think you may be on to something -->>> Might be. I just wish Canon would publish specs on their accessories so we'd have a shot at making better decisions. __________________ "Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence..." - Calvin Coolidge "My brain is wired to want to know how other things are wired." - Me

July 15th, 2004, 11:59 PM	#2
Matt Gettemeier Major Player Join Date: May 2003 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 936	Thanks for posting that Jeff! I wish EVERYBODY did stuff like this... About a year and a half ago I wondered why there could be SO many different mic selections at every price-point and in every class. It seems like there should just be an obvious choice to fill whatever need a person has... In this case it's clear that the Sennheiser is the winner and your clip also answers questions about the differences between that mic and that model of Azden. Thanks again for going to the trouble to share that.

July 16th, 2004, 03:56 PM	#3
Dave Largent Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 1,483	I'd be interested to hear what your test here is designed to show. Sensitivity? Sound quality? If it's the quality, you'd get a more fair comparison by equalizing the recorded volumes of the two mics. As it is, the Senn is recorded at 2 1/2 times the level of the Azden, and it's known that persons will often pick the louder one as better, just because it's louder.

July 18th, 2004, 08:22 PM	#7
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	Both sound crappy indoors IMO, but that's because shotgun mics don't do very well indoors. The echo/reverb makes the sound hollow and artificial to my eyes. As far as the two mics go, the Azden sounds "warmer". I tried making the Sennheiser sound warmer like the Azden. In Vegas, you can get a lot closer by putting the Smooth/Enhance filter on and setting it to smooth 2 notches (5 notches either way is the max). If you look at the waveforms of both mics, the Sennheiser is noticeably more detailed (after normalization). The Azden sounds like it has distortion on certain words. I'm not sure if I'm interpreting that right. If you didn't get to process the sound in post, I would like the Azden a little better because it sounds warm/nice compared to the hollow/realistic/artificial sound of the ME66. If the mic was used for real projects, the ME66 would likely be better depending on what kind of sound you want. If you are looking for "warm-sounding" voice then you'd be looking at something other than a shotgun. Anyways, thanks for the comparison! I would find it useful if buying a shotgun mic. 2- I was listening to the sound on my pair of AKG66 headphones (AKG66 review: they're headphones). The shotguns sound better when panned to just one ear. I don't like the weird reverb when the sound is panned center.

July 18th, 2004, 10:40 PM	#9
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	The Azden has a sensitivety of -41db @ 1 pa the Sennheiser is -25 db @1pa (10mvvs 50 mv). That means the sennheiser is more than 2.5 times hotter, hence the difference in volume. Bottom line is the Azden isn't a pro gear, the sennheiser is quieter, hotter and has more dynamic range. __________________ Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ".......holy smokin rubber lips...what a ride!"

July 19th, 2004, 06:58 AM	#10
Jay Massengill Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Burlington Posts: 1,976	I'd also say that when making a comparison test you should set each mic to get their optimum performance. While it is important to understand which mics are more sensitive than others, simply setting both mics to the same arbitrary number on your input controls doesn't really tell you what each can accomplish. If you only had the one mic, you wouldn't arbitrarily set your controls, you'd adjust them for best performance with the equipment you had. Do the same when making a comparison recording. If the difference in sensitivity is so wide that there's still a noticeable change in the volume levels of the camera recording, then it is helpful to make them equivalent later. Just keep in mind the extra step that was needed for the weaker source if you were doing this for real and also carefully listen for the additional noise that this step may add. Have your mics positioned and supported as similarly as possible, without getting them so close to each other that they begin to physically alter each other's sound. Record simultaneous split tracks of the same sound source. Put the clips on your NLE, center them, make their volume equal, then cut them together so there's no gap when switching from one to the other. Listen carefully as your NLE plays back the whole sequence and even subtle differences start to be more easily recognized.

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